What about a project preset?

doodyrh · Post by **doodyrh** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 6:41 pm

Imagine a preset window launched from the LiveBar which stores every setting on every device in your project - synths, effects, mixers.

As an analogy, think of the Modular where the patch is the project (all the modules and their interconnections) and the presets are the... err... presets.

How cool would that be?
Would it be:
a) cool
b) cool
c) cool or
d) all of the above?

siberiansun · Post by **siberiansun** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 6:57 pm

sounds like a great idea!
AND the preset window should be like in logic, sort of a curtain coming down.
so sick of all windows in SFP.
in fact, ALL SFP preset windows should be curtains on existing "main" windows.
now how about that?

*cool?
*awesome?
*wicked?
*smashing?

all of the above?

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 7:58 pm

I may be wrong, but wasn't that exactly the behaviour of a pre SFP project ?
The preset handling is the only item in SFP that s*cks imho. The old 'save with device' method worked much better for me.
Well, it's a little annoying but no show stopper, let's see what the next release will bring...

cheers, Tom

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 11:57 pm

EEEEEWWWW!!!! The "Save with device" thing was TERRIBLE!!!! I hated it with a passion! I was rejoicing and jumping up and down with glee when Pulsar 3.0 came out with the new preset lists. They're WAY better!! Now I can organize my presets properly without having them "attached" to devices.

As for drop-down preset management, you can already load and change presets via menus in the Live Bar, you just can't save them without bringing up the preset dialog box. But is that really so difficult? It has dates, notes, and author information. Much more intelligent than the old methods.

Sorry if this message sounds like a rant, but I just couldn't stand the way the old presets worked.

Shayne

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 4:12 am

Yeah i'm with Shayne on that one. Look at the presets i've uploaded recently. i never even made presets with the old style system because you couldn't organise them into banks, you had to drag 'n' drop new presets into the one preset list, then number them manually, and you could only have 127 presets. Now i can have one preset list with loads of banks and because it's its own file i can just copy it and post it here. Also with the info section you can name the author, avoiding that typographical nightmare that was: "Techno Bass (RS)", "Strings (sh)" etc. which just looks messy.

Mr A

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 4:50 am

Is this turning into a poll ?

I liked "save with device" much better. It was the more intuitive system IMHO.

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 4:52 am

Ok then, i prefer v3 type presets lists...

For the reason i can backup my presets.

King of Snake · Post by **King of Snake** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 5:49 am

On 2003-06-03 19:41, doodyrh wrote:
Imagine a preset window launched from the LiveBar which stores every setting on every device in your project - synths, effects, mixers.

?? All these settings are stored when you save a project. What is it exactly that you want differently?

doodyrh · Post by **doodyrh** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 5:57 am

I'm definitely a fan of the new style presets but there's still plenty of potential for click saving.

Also, the old presets were H U G E !
They could've saved a million knobs with 1 to 1,000,000,000 resolution on each. And then some. Talk about saving the presets with the device; I think they also saved the device with the presets.

But my original point was for a project preset that would be a snapshot of everything in the project. One single operation instead of one for every device.

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 5:58 am

yeah, all valid arguments for the sfp preset style

I never paid too much attention to this, but I can't help the feeling that the old projects indeed did save (were intended to save...) all and everything of the setup, including presets (together with the device in that case).
Maybe they should return to that practice but keep the presets (in the new form with more info) in separate files.

cheers, Tom

doodyrh · Post by **doodyrh** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:16 am

On 2003-06-04 06:49, King of Snake wrote:
All these settings are stored when you save a project. What is it exactly that you want differently?

Agreed. There are plenty of times I wish I'd saved the project alongside the Cubase files.

But presets help organisation by creating a hierachary: project, bank, preset.
I'd like to be able to record the entire chain that leads to a sound without creating a new top level in the hierarchy. I already always use the MultiFX which can save up to six effects presets in one. But that's just the start.

rodos1979 · Post by **rodos1979** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:23 am

Hello to all!

I dont have time to write a lot of things. I would prefer the next SFP release (SFP 4), to provide the option of choosing between old preset style (pre-SFP) and SFP style.
In this way, everybody will be happy!

Just a thought.

doodyrh · Post by **doodyrh** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 9:41 am

Talking of hierarchy, why are the preset window menus ordered 'bank, preset, file' and not 'file, bank, preset'? This would be more logical and also fit the standard windows convention better.

Btw, maybe I'm slow but I just found out what the compare button does:
"Use this button to switch back and forth
between a selected preset and the current
device settings. For example, use this to
load a preset, make some changes to it,
and then compare it with the original
without loosing the changes."

King of Snake · Post by **King of Snake** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 11:06 am

Heh, I never bothered to look that one up either

Good to know though.

doodyrh · Post by **doodyrh** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 1:20 pm

OK, I'm prepared to compromise. I have a dream...

...of a module just like the MultiFX except that the first slot holds a synth and the others accomodate effects. Wet and dry knobs at the end might be handy too, which also serve as a final make-up gain. The preset holds this and all the presets of the contained devices.

And the icing on the cake?
New style presets on Celmo's GAM so it can join the party

borg · Post by **borg** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:06 pm

i've been thinking about this topic lately as well. i'd like to get on stage with a laptop, magma and sfp, but the loading time between projects is a bit... mmm, a painful thing. i was thinking of stuffing one big project with some (a lot) devices, and then have something like the screen sets (have never used them though)in which for the synths voices will change and for fx on or off... and of course preset change for all devices.

i doubt it would improve/lower loading time as all dsp allocation will have to be redone, but at least, it would solve some asio woes for a few happy ones.

but, as i'm working more and more with the same synths, this would be a nice gift if it gets through.
i see the advantages if worked out in a clever and time saving manner, i vote'go for it'

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:26 pm

A project preset containing all knobs, faders, buttons settings etc would need no DSP reloading, it just resets currently loaded stuff to new values, as fast as in SFP devices preset lists. However, as long as there's also 2.04 devices in the project it'll be hard to do. The old preset lists are only one-way compatible: they can be loaded in new preset list (cfr. loading and converting of old Inferno presets to new version), but the 2.04 device can't be updated from that.

Another feature I'd like to see is to save clusters of devices.

I do not think they'll do that, since it adds not much to the musical possibilities of the platform. Plus it might take loads of engineering time to make that possible...

doodyrh · Post by **doodyrh** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 5:27 pm

On 2003-06-04 15:06, borg wrote:
...have something like the screen sets ... in which for the synths voices will change and for fx on or off...

The screen sets only store window sizes and the location of the modules on the screen, not their settings.

On 2003-06-04 15:26, at0mic wrote:
A project preset containing all knobs, faders, buttons settings etc would need no DSP reloading

The MultiFX presets can load new FX. Whether this is technically possible or even desirable for the project preset is another question. If new devices are to be loaded it's starting to look like a new project.

Here's another preset wish I've aired before in case any CW genii (?) are eavesdropping.
On opening the preset window I want to see which preset is currently loaded, say with coloured highlighting. If a preset is loaded but settings have been changed I want to see another colour (this is indicated in the LiveBar with a *. However, when individual FX are loaded in MultiFX they're not visible in the LiveBar - so there's no way of telling). Finally, presets selected with a single-click only should be highlighted with a third colour.

I don't ask much do I?

borg · Post by **borg** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:43 pm

On 2003-06-04 15:26, at0mic wrote:
A project preset containing all knobs, faders, buttons settings etc would need no DSP reloading, it just resets currently loaded stuff to new values, as fast as in SFP devices preset lists.

Another feature I'd like to see is to save clusters of devices.

1. correct, but when the number of voices, it's a whole new dsp world.
2. that would be nice, the cluster thing...

doodyrh wrote:

On opening the preset window I want to see which preset is currently loaded, say with coloured highlighting.

oh yes, can't figure out why it hasn't been like that from the start... essential

zezappa · Post by **zezappa** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 8:13 pm

After several genial ideas exposed, the most important issue to improve in SFP, IMO.

On 2003-06-04 18:27, doodyrh wrote:
On opening the preset window I want to see which preset is currently loaded. when individual FX are loaded in MultiFX they're not visible in the LiveBar.

it seems this also aplies to Inserts, Int. sends and free devices.
And in XTC mode I usualy must save each used SFP preset (of all devices) as a VST preset (*.fxp) but impossible with banks (*.fxb) and so, impossible to send program change messages though this is the least.

Wouldn't it be possible to see the loaded preset in each device window instead in live bar?
maybe CW team remember it next SFP release, if it'll be