About Studio monitors...again!...

rodos1979 · Post by **rodos1979** » Fri Apr 11, 2003 12:34 pm

Hello to all!

I have reached that point that I *MUST* buy some studio monitors. I had some models in mind, but things get more complicated as some of them I cannot easily find here in Greece, and furthermore I find completely different prices...
I was thinking to go for the Mackie HR624. I found them in one shop here at 1050euros each! I asked the Mackie dealer here and they told me I could buy a pair at 1500euros but I would have to wait 20 days for them to bring the monitors... In the first shop, they were suggesting me to buy the Tannoy Reveal Active. They I argued that I dont need such a good studio monitor for a home studio which is not acoustically treated (could they be right?)
Then I had a look at Thomann Musihaus Cyberstore (excellent site by the way!), and I found the Mackies for 666euros each! I send them an email to ask them about shipping charges etc, and if they could suggest me a studio monitor in the 800-1200euros pricerange for a pair. They suggested me the the Adam P11-A. Which has almost the same price as the Mackies (the Mackies are a few euros more expensive). Does anybody of you know the Adam P11-A? Are they good? Would you go for the Adam or for the Mackie? What I thought is the following: The Adam are German...and the Mackie are American, which means that there is a lot of import tax in their price. So if they cost 666euros in Europe, their real price would be something like 550euros. If both of them have the same price/performance ratio then the Adam must be better... I dont know, what do you think about all that? Which monitor do you suggest? The Mackie HR624, the Adam P11A or the Tannoy Reveal Active for a home studio?

Thank you

P.S. ...another one of my concerns is the following: since this unfair Iraq War, I try to avoid buying American products as a way of protest against the Bush policy.. American people, this has nothing to do with you. It is just that I dont like the policy of your government.
Peace for all

aMo · Post by **aMo** » Fri Apr 11, 2003 12:53 pm

Good moove..

I'm sure that American companies that are within the music/studio industry is probalby shipping studio-monitors and other musical equipment to both the American government and their armed forces..

Do you really think that ALL of the US is pro-war?

Sorry for beeing of topic folks..

regards
aMo - From Norway, who is neutral this time..

EDIT: oops... you should SELL your CW stuff.. they have an office in the US!

[ This Message was edited by: aMo on 2003-04-11 13:55 ]

Tony B · Post by **Tony B** » Fri Apr 11, 2003 2:20 pm

I have heard the Mackie and it sounds very good. Anything better would have to be reaaaal goooood. I would be buying a pair shortly. I took advice and bought a pair of cheap Edirol 15a monitor speakers. I regret it because I cannot even get them sell now. Don't bother with that. Get the best monitor you can afford.

Post by **hubird** » Sat Apr 12, 2003 4:40 pm

I keep promoting A.D.A.M 11-A nearfields.
In a major nearfields test in the German Keyboards mag. they even beated the nr.1 Genelecs (2030 was it?).
I heard both of them 'together' in a big shop listnening room, it's absolutely unbelievable how good these 11-A 's sound.
See http://www.adam-audio.de/

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Sat Apr 12, 2003 7:27 pm

I know that test you refer to and in my very humble very personal opinion it was a well designed marketing campaign:
pro ADAM and Genelec - con Mackie and KRK and of course Behringer

My opinion has NOTHING to do with the monitors, they are certainly great, but there was a 'read between the lines' convincement which could only lead to one buying decision: ADAM or Genelec.

I've already posted this opinion on an ealier occasion, but the making of the test is that brilliant (from marketing viewpoint) that it deserves another mention

cheers, Tom

Post by **hubird** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 8:50 am

Hi Astro, I don't have that review here at the moment, but I can remember the Mackies got very high top rates too.
Also they proclaimed winners for the best price/quality ratio.
Adam is German (Berlin), Genelec is not.
Hmm, you've got that feeling some way or another.
It's always good to stay critical, but it's a fact that I agreed the outcome of the test

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 11:08 am

I too am looking at the Mackies. Unless you want testicle rumbling bass, the HR624s are amazing. I however like ball rumbling bass and am getting the HR824s. I've had a bunch of Guitar Center folk tell me that the KRK V8s are the greatest invention since life itself and that all bow before it, but I think it colors the sound too much. The Genelecs are fairly uncolored, but I can't sense the same level of sonic detail (like transients and delays/reverb tails, etc.) as I can in the HR824s, and given that, at least the last time I checked, the Mackies are way cheaper than the Genelecs.

Sam

p.s. my .02 cents, reviews are the most useless/unobjective way to make a purchase decision. The only way to make an educated decision on what sounds good is to go put your head in front of it for a while be it synth, speaker, pre, or processor fan. Reviews should only be viewed as a means of finding out what's out there and how one should whittle down their options.

p.p.s. That was a long p.s.

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 11:43 am

I have a pair of Mackie HR824s, and I wouldn't part with them for the world! Even in my "untreated" studio they pretty much reveal everything. Very, very high quality. The reviews of the HR624s said that the 624s actually have slightly more accurate mid-range than the 824s, but not quite as much bass; so it depends on what you want. At any rate, you can't go wrong with either of them -- definitely shoot for the best!

Shayne

P.S. I really don't think liberating the Iraqi people from horrible oppression (included randomly getting shot down on the freeway by Saddam's sons) is "unfair policy."

Michu · Post by **Michu** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 1:36 pm

re: aMo

they may be nicest people in the world, but if they pay taxes in America, then part of their income is directed to US military budget.

Anyway i know shite about monitors, i use NS10s

aMo · Post by **aMo** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 1:58 pm

Well, I pay taxes in Norway, and we sell amunition to the Israelis, which they use to kill Palestinians...

That does NOT make ME a criminal...

The decicions the leaders of a country makes, does NOT ALWAYS reflect the people's opinions...

But if he wants to NOT buy good quality gear because of something that has absolutely NOTHING to do with the makers of that gear, he can go ahead... That's his problem...

ReD_MuZe · Post by **ReD_MuZe** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 3:44 pm

the war has switched something in my mind.
all governments are bad.
anyone trying to fight a government through the people is just as bad as bush imho.

i can say form 1st source (im an israeli)
that agression like people are developing tward the US, is NOT GOING TO SOLVE ANYTHING!

its just going to start another war.
and as an anti war person, i think the first step(however newagish it might sound) is to get rid of your own agression.

i am sure that the american people will let bush know what they think of him in the elections, before he does any more harm.

there is the right way and the wrong way. the right way, is to remember that we all share one globe. and payback at the americans, becouse of a false government is BAD.
i think bush should be put to trial. to make an example for all leaders. but depriving good people from food. becouse you dont like their government. thats silly!

and about israel and plaestine. that remark about "criminal". when yuo look at a picture, you have to remeber there are 2 sides. in my opinion, both of them are as bad. bombing sivilans, on demand (arafat) and destroying palestinian market places (sharon) looks more like a personal fight.

sharon=arafat=bush=sadam - criminals.

but I, am no criminal.
i have been teaching music in arabic schools as a university student, and dedicating my music to peace.
so please, try to look at the whole picture. its not all black and white.

right now, we have to make sure, that events lik this dont happen anymore, so our cildren can refer to war, as history tales and not as reality!

ho, an just to be on topic...
i warmly suggest getting tannoy reveals (cheap but reliable, fat, fun to work with and acurate), yamaha ns10's(fatiguing, but what you get right on those baybies, never misses) or quested (my favorite).

i dont suggest:
machie ("at home it sounds better"), bheringer (ahh!! my ears!), HHB (speakers covered with a blanket), jbl (nice hi-fi system), alessis (carboard sound) and event (low mids? who needs'em?).
they all have flaws that need you to know the monitor well befor getting a deacent mix.

genelecs are also good, but they are not my taste, i think they generate way too much bass for their size. i recomend them only for bigger studios where the other nearfileds sound powerless. (becouse what they realy need is midfields but hate to admit it)

woooh long post? whn is it going to end?
joint anyone?

[ This Message was edited by: ReD_MuZe on 2003-04-13 16:45 ]

Michu · Post by **Michu** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 3:51 pm

there is a difference
i pay taxes and i am voter in Poland, and i will be able to vote against people who lended thugs to Bush.
I am not voter in America and only way of showing my deep disapreciacion to their policy is not supporting their economy (apart from marching on the streets of course)

Besides Mackie there is ADAM, Tannoy or Dynaudio (pricey but i am yet to hear someone unhappy with them)
so you are not condemned to one product.

ok, can we agree that we don't agree and stop stealing this thread?

Michu · Post by **Michu** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 3:59 pm

i am sure that the american people will let bush know what they think of him in the elections, before he does any more harm.

Muze, i always admire your optimism

aMo · Post by **aMo** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 5:21 pm

ReD_MuZe: That was not ment as anything bad to the Israeli people, but to the fact that both our goverments do many things that we, the people, don't agree with..

People like you and me have way better things to do.. WAY better...

(The whole anti-US thing got me a bit upset because I would have recomended Alesis Monitors hehe)

Post by **hubird** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 5:41 pm

Dann, I'm so glad my nearfields are ADAM, not SADAM...

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 11:29 pm

hehe. selecting a monitor speaker with politics in mind.. interesting.

I'd say go for the best you can afford. Dont' worry if your room's not treated or whatever. Just get the speakers, and then figure out a way to get the best sound out of it. They're a big investment so you don't wanto to regret having cheaped out.

I use Event 20/20 bas, by the way, and I'm extremely happy with it. Of course, I've already spent about 2 years with it, so I know it fairly well. Maybe that's why I'm content with it.

We should probably have everyone list monitors they've mixed with (over 1 year) and then compile a huge list. With ratings and all. Personally, I don't think much can be judged with a couple hours at the shop. It takes more than an year to actually "learn" the monitors.

[ This Message was edited by: kensuguro on 2003-04-14 00:30 ]

ReD_MuZe · Post by **ReD_MuZe** » Mon Apr 14, 2003 3:37 am

i dont think that knowing your monitors is a good thing...
i chose my reveals the folowing way:
i took several speekers, and mixed with them.
the best mix won.
and i bought the my reveals.
you shoul try and get them for a week to test befor you buy

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Mon Apr 14, 2003 4:37 am

On 2003-04-14 04:37, ReD_MuZe wrote:
i dont think that knowing your monitors is a good thing...

it's almost inevitable. Your brain adapts to any preception - and it does it quick and without asking your permission

To know the monitor just means to be able to predict the result in another environement.
Your suggestion how to choose the monitor is very good, if you have a nice dealer around.
Unfortunately it's not always the case

I prefer to buy local.

cheers, Tom

aMo · Post by **aMo** » Mon Apr 14, 2003 5:10 am

My dealer is TOO nice..hehe

He practically still owns half my studio-gear..hehehe

<img src="http://www.stordahlmusikk.no/images/Gun ... 00x105.jpg">
And there he is..hehehe

[ This Message was edited by: aMo on 2003-04-14 06:11 ]

Post by **hubird** » Mon Apr 14, 2003 11:12 am

I checked again the test mentioned before.
If you can afford it and can go for pure quality, the advice is to listen to these and make your personal choice:
Mackie HR824, Event 20/20bas, DynAudio BM6A, Genelec 1030APM, and A.D.A.M. P11-A.

If economics are involved the two winners are Event PS-6 and Klein+Hummel O100.

With Astroman I would like to emphasize the necessity to listen carefully in comparison.
Both statements of Astro are true in every inch:
-Your brain adapts to any preception
-To know the monitor just means to be able to predict the result in another environement.