Presets, hundreds of presets . . . a new Z project

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 9:05 am

On some forums presets users are treated with some disdain as if they are like some sort of Casio home organ user. In reply the preset users say they are in the business of making music, not tweaking knobs. But presets at the very least are the starting point for writing music, maybe you change them, maybe not, but they can at least get you going.

The point of this long ramble is this: perhaps we could choose one good synth on the platform and each interested person could write maybe 20 or so sounds of a particular sort ? One person might write arpeggio-style basses, another person writes leads, another weird FX, another pads etc.

At the end all the patches are collected into a single file and posted. We could also filter out the duds from the default bank and give them more indicative names.

Hopefully we would end up with a preset file of several hundred really stunning sounds. (Is there a limit to the number of sounds in one bank ?) Companies such as NI charge a small fortune for good presets, but there's no reason why we can't have top quality sounds to share amongst ourselves at the cost of just a little effort.

To make this work we'd need to choose a synth which has the capability to produce a large range of sounds, then divide up the sound categories among the patch-makers. As a little touch of glory we could have the initials or short nickname of the creator with every patch.

My personal choice would be the Prisma, but I'm sure there are other likely candidates too - anyone have any preferences ?

I'd be happy to co-ordinate the collection of the presets into a single file and also to write quite a few.

Is anyone interested in this ? To work we'd need at LEAST half a dozen people, hopefully many more.

at0m · Post by **at0m** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 12:30 pm

Afaik there's no max number of presets in a bank, although it's easy to use max. 128 and make extra banks for more presets.

We could also ask people to send in current presets. It might be handy to make some uniform preset names so it's easy to determine their type etc.

Looking forward to more!

dehuszar · Post by **dehuszar** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 1:16 pm

I say we start with either Prisma or Saturn as they're available to almost everyone (Saturn is anyway) and have tremendous diversity and depth.

Sam

Immanuel · Post by **Immanuel** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 3:28 pm

I wm rather unexperienced with the synths, so I can not contribute. But I fully back up the project

petal · Post by **petal** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 5:00 pm

I would like to be a part of this, but being a poor Elektra-owner, I don't have the Prisma.......
Perhaps we could run two project, one for a commercial synth, and one for a free synth. In this way we would help the developers of the free synth, by giving them some of the focus of attention

Cheers!
Thomas

Immanuel · Post by **Immanuel** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 6:14 pm

Still just talking (not doing anything), but I think it would be great to see it done to 3rd party products. CW apears to not support them too well - then let us (err - you) do it

eliam · Post by **eliam** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 6:18 pm

Is there not many presets already stored on PlanetZ? Maybe the project could include sifting through the already released presets so to make a complete bundle... I don't have the prisma synth either.

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:31 pm

A free synth and a commercial synth sounds good - so long as enough people want to contribute.

The vote so far seems to be Saturn and Prisma. Any other favourites ?

Excellent idea to include the presets already posted. It'll be good to have everything sorted and together in one file. Posted files include patches for Minimax, Uknow, Inferno & Saturn.

Depending on how many patchmakers we have we can make the sound-type categories quite diverse. It will also depend in part on which synths we choose. I'm thinking that the patches might look like this:

category - name - maker

bass-plucked2 petal
bass-plucked3 petal
perc-noise1 spirit

More patchmakers needed

_________________
Where I rest . . .

[ This Message was edited by: spirit on 2003-01-11 19:50 ]

petal · Post by **petal** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:52 pm

Well, yes there are some presets here on PlanetZ already, and the Saturn is already wellrepresentated, so maybe that isn't best choise in my opinion... I think I'll look into a few alternative candidates tomorrow.

One of the good things about such an "event" like this one, imho, is the focus it will bring on the chosen synths and hopefully newly gained interest in patchmaking and not so wellknown synths..

Thomas

[ This Message was edited by: Petal on 2003-01-11 20:35 ]

zezappa · Post by **zezappa** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:53 pm

if some No-Fi presets are needed you can count on me

eliam · Post by **eliam** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 11:47 pm

This whole idea is awesome and may open new unexpected horizons and renew interest in the chosen synths! I'd like to participate, but I'm not sure how much time I can have for this... Now my mind is busy with the modular and other important stuff... We'll see...

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 1:13 am

Anything that is contributed - even just a handful of good sounds - will be very worthwhile

Don't worry about how many ! After all, this will only work if a few of us get behind the idea. Share some of your own good patches and receive many more good ones in return

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 5:11 am

so which synth is it anyway? I'm not very familiar with the prisma... but I can try. I'm not in the habbit of using presets. I use lots of hummel bluesynth tho.

Ben Walker · Post by **Ben Walker** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 6:08 am

Count me in. Setting yourself the task of writing some good presets is a really good way to explore the construction and potential of a synth.
I think the Prisma is a good idea - it's a very versatile synth and quite unexplored from my own point of view.
I'd say banks shouldn't be above 128 in length as this makes program changes impossible and also makes for huge long lists - I'd prefer a few smaller banks.
As for preset naming, for the newer synths (inc Prisma) there's no need to include the type of preset in the name as there's the category field for this, and you can sort your preset list by category or name with a single click.
A non-commercial, non-cw Synth might also be a good idea. I'll go along with whatever is decided.
Cheers,
Ben

borg · Post by **borg** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 6:41 am

happy to join

ChrisWerner · Post by **ChrisWerner** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 8:37 am

I could be the Pad-Man on any synth we like.
When we start?

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 8:39 am

Project is looking viable !

The Prisma seems to be the winner so far. The only negative about the Prisma is that some people don't have it - but then perhaps this might inspire them since it's definitely worth the price.

Regarding the patch names, I suggested putting a short category first like this:

bass-squelchy Mr X
bass-drone1 Spirit

The reason is that the patch name by itself is irrelevant. For example, the prisma sound "magneto" means nothing really, it's only the category that gives much of an idea (bright pad).

For that reason I think every sound should be labelled with a category in the name first. That means they are always sorted by category by default, and leaves the actual "category" field available for something else. As a bonus for the patchmakers I'd suggest it should be their name. That way you could sort sounds by the patchmaker if you found you really liked a particular person's patches.

Limiting banks to 128 sounds is wise. Let's do that.

Once we finalise the synth (which we'll do by tomorrow), the next step is to decide who programs what.

We could decide upon our sound categories and then let the patchmakers choose which one they want to write for - double-ups welcome. Of course any extra patches are also invited! Other patchmakers may just decide to do a 20-sound mixture in which case their name in the "category" field can show their work

The categories that exist in the Prisma default bank are:

Arpeggio
BrightPad
DarkPad
ElPerc
ElPiano
HardLead
MotionPad
Organ
Pulsating
Sequencer
SoftLead
SoftPad
Strings
SynthBass
SynthBell
SynthBrass
SynthFX
SynthKeys
TechnoBass
TunedPerc

IMHO we should revise these.

How about a very "straight" and concise list:

Bass (all bass sounds including drones)
Lead ("character" sounds for riffs)
Arpg (LFO-based arpeggios and bpm FX)
Pads (all strings, sweeps, evolutions)
Keys (sounds for real keyboard players)
Perc (percussion: noise hits, toms & zaps)
SFX (non-musical weirdness)
Real (organ, brass, oboe, harp etc)

Other possible categories:

Hard (nasty sync, high-resonance etc)
Soft (sweet, slow & ambient)
Cute (silly & cheezy sounds)
Evil (ominous and eerie)

More category ideas ?

_________________
Where I rest . . .

[ This Message was edited by: Spirit on 2003-01-12 08:49 ]

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 9:15 am

I took a look at Prisma.. not sure if I can get into it, but the architecture itself looks very potent. (me, if I were to do something Prisma could, I'd do it in mod) But anyway, whatever's cool. I hope it's a very potent synth you choose, so that we can have a do-it all type synth.

I was also thinking that instead of bunching everything into the 128 presets in a bank, why don't we just separate the categories into separate banks? That may make browsing much easier, since there will only be say 20-30 per bank, and only a dozen of banks. (easy memorizing too)

As for which catergory I'll do? Of course, before I can say it, it'll probably be keys.

I also thought that the straight categorizing list was cool. keys, synth, bass, etc.

petal · Post by **petal** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 9:34 am

I went through the device-archive and didn't find something that sprung to my eye as a real alternative to the Saturn other than my new found love, the MiniScope WE. What speaks against it though, is that I'm not sure if it's entirely free and it is "only" a mod of an existing CW synth, which wasn't exactly what I was set out to find..... So if noone else has a good suggestion for a free 3rd-dparty synth other than the Saturn, then I guess the Saturn is the choise for the thirdparty synth, if there is still interest for a free 3rd-party synth in this project. How many would make patches for it besides me?

Thomas

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 9:38 am

me, I think I want to stay away from Prisma, because of the time it takes to set up a patch. I probably just have to get used to it, but I guess I'm not in the mood at the current moment. (just a personal preference) Besides, I think it may be better if people who are already used to Prisma make the patches. Quicker, efficient.

Hey, also, I thought that instead of making "this guy does this category", why don't we all do all the categories? I can do keys, but I also have lots of for a bunch of other categories. (like hiphop bass that doesn't sound like CW's crap)

[ This Message was edited by: kensuguro on 2003-01-12 09:41 ]