A16 Ultra is balanced - are my VIRUS B and XV3080 balanced?

mano · Post by **mano** » Tue Feb 26, 2002 9:25 pm

The title says it all... Are my Virus B and XV3080 featuring balanced outputs?

I am receiving my A16 Ultra tomorrow (again subhuman you rock!) and I am not sure if my gear is balanced or not...

Sub told me that if I wanted to use unbalanced gear with the A16 I'd have to get special cables with ground lift...

Any of you could tell me if those 2 models have balanced outputs?

They are 1/4 jacks, so i thought it should be unbalanced, but I remember reading on a virus list someone sayng those were balanced... I am a bit confused

heres a pic of the A16Ultra's back.. apparently those holes are 1/4 inch jacks as well... so if those are balanced, then my virus B and XV may very well be balanced too?

What do you think?
thank you

-mano

[ This Message was edited by: mano1.com on 2002-02-26 21:36 ]

darolek · Post by **darolek** » Tue Feb 26, 2002 10:11 pm

Hi Mano !
Read this - mayby helpful:

Balanced
In audio, the opposite of Unbalanced. For us balanced refers to a type of AC electrical signal having two "legs" independent of ground. One is generally considered positive (+) and the other negative (-) in voltage and current flow with respect to ground. Unlike unbalanced audio lines there is no "signal" carried in the shield or ground connection unless there is a fault. The main benefit is that any noise that gets induced into the line will be common to both the positive and negative sides and thus canceled when it arrives at its destination, assuming the destination is balanced. This phenomenon is called "Common Mode Rejection" and basically just means that any signals common to both the positive and negative legs of balanced lines get canceled. This happens because when the receiving device looks at the signal the common noise actually shows up as out of phase with itself, and gets cancelled. Think of it as if the negative (-) signal gets inverted to positive (+) before use, which puts the desired audio signal in phase with the already positive other leg and at the same time causes the undesired common noise to become out of phase with itself. Clear as mud? Balanced lines are generally much better for long cable runs due to their ability to reject induced noises. XLR and TRS type cables are designed to transmit balanced audio from one balanced device to another. A standard 1/4-inch guitar cable is an example of an unbalanced cable. Another (newer) application of balancing that is becoming popular in audio systems is the idea of balanced power systems. Fundamentally the concept is the same. There is a positive and negative (with respect to ground) leg of electricity at every electrical outlet. The idea is that the power supply of any devices connected can then reject any noise induced on the AC line and thus will produce cleaner audio. We'll talk more about balanced AC systems in the future.

samuel40 · Post by **samuel40** » Wed Feb 27, 2002 7:05 am

Hey this has confused me as well, i want to know is there a way you can tell balanced or unbalanced by looking at the cable or equipment or do you have to find the manual for you equipment. please forgive me for sounding uninformed... but i am... i would hate to blow up my equipment in experimentation mode

subhuman · Post by **subhuman** » Wed Feb 27, 2002 8:44 am

Balanced cables look like stereo 1/4" cable, they have a tip and ring. You can't usually tell if your equipment is balanced by simply looking at the connectors though, this is something you find from looking at specs or in the manual.

mano · Post by **mano** » Wed Feb 27, 2002 9:35 am

Access just confirmed that the Virus B is all unbalanced... after reading what sub said it doesn't surprise me.

... I think the XV3080 is the same way

should I bring back to the store all the 1/4 mono jacks I bought, and buy another kind of cables? or buy a bunch of adapters to plug to the A16 connectors?

What is the best way to go?

Thanks a lot for your help. I want to make things right

[ This Message was edited by: mano1.com on 2002-02-27 10:14 ]

mano · Post by **mano** » Wed Feb 27, 2002 4:04 pm

wait

i read in this thread named "A16 my lil' review":

"...This doesn't apply to the inputs on the A16, it'll recognise an unbalanced signal there"

so... I should be able to plug my unbalanced equipment with mono jacks to the A16 INPUTS right?

Then there is still the outputs issue... I'll mainly use 2 for now, connected to my preamplifier (rolls mx28).

if you know something that might help me let me know

Post by **garyb** » Wed Feb 27, 2002 5:55 pm

all depends on which parts of the cable are soldered to which parts of the connector. most of the time with 1/4" connectors,the tip is hot and the sleeve is shield and cold together(unbalanced).most of the time with 1/4" BALANCED tip is hot ring is cold and sleeve is shield.so....if you connect a unbalanced cable to a balaced input,all that normally happens is that it unbalances the input.(connects ground to cold)if there are no grounding problems,there are no problems! if one needs to lift ground on a cable,use mic cable,solder 1/4" trs (tip ring sleeve) jack to a 1/4" phone jack (tip sleeve) as follows: tip to tip ,ring to sleeve, sleeve to nowhere(connect at trs end but cut back and leave disconnected at ts end)obviously, the trs end goes to the balanced device and provides shielding for the cable.this cable will stop ground loops between the two devices.a regular cable will prob'bly do fine,however and tricky wiring is not likely to be needed.(as long as there is no 60hz hum)this is very basic studio wiring.

[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2002-02-28 23:19 ]

Round1 · Post by **Round1** » Thu Feb 28, 2002 2:22 am

Mano1.....read the manual when you get it. It tells you the recommended way to wire the A16 outputs to balanced and unbalanced gear. If you are in any way unsure then I would suggest you contact the dealer who you purchased it from.