using gate

[firubbi]

i start using scope gate to cut the floor noise bellow 60dB. what the cons of using gate? does it eat hi frequency?? is there any hi end scope gate is there?
thanks

[garyb]

the disadvantage of a gate is that it can chop off the tails of sustained sounds.

as always, it's best to start with clean tracks to begin with, and that includes whatever it takes to get them, better isolation, wiring, grounding, whatever. the gate is, never the less, a valuable tool.

another type of gate is the expander. it can be more subtle in action as it behaves opposite a compressor, where the compressor makes louder sounds quieter and quieter sounds louder, the expander makes quieter sounds qiuieter and loud sounds louder.....

depending on where in the signal chain the gate is used, i think that it's a tool that could well be used in the sequencer's mixer insert(i usually like the gate as the first plugin in a chain, anyway). for special effects, maybe otherwise...

[firubbi]

thanks garyb,
im thinking for better isolation. what you put in the floor of vocal room. is that only glass wool and wood. someone told me using sand under the wood can reduce floor noise! my studio is on 2nd floor

[ChampionSound]

Also try to keep powercables and signalcables of your external gear apart from eachother to avoid extra noise.

To prevent chopping off tails, you could extend the hold and/or release parameters, but this will only be effective if the notes/sounds aren't triggered too quickly after each other.

I'm just making this up right now, but you could also experiment with building a multiband gate by using Alfonso's X-over device and set the crossover frequency at e.g. 5 kHz, then insert a gate only in the >5kHz slot, to eliminate the highfreq hiss noisefloor, while leaving most of the sound unaffected.
Or do it the other way around and only insert a gate in the lower frequency slot to reduce the rumble or ambient noise and leave the highs unaffected. Isn't scope just fantastic for this kind of stuff?

Last remedy could be offline processing (using a noise remover in your sequencer app or wave editor), where the noise profile will be analyzed and will be applied on the sound. But results can affect the original sound and therefore reduce the soundquality, so for me this is the last option.

[garyb]

don't record the vocal while you record the rest of the instruments. you can have the vocalist perform, so that the band knows where they are, but treat the vocal as a scratch track and rerecord it after. you'll have plently of isolation then, and you won't need a gate. i find gates work best on percussive tracks. i don't like them on vocals. jmho.

[alfonso]

When it's possible, and with vocals it's usually very possible, editing the wave and cutting off the empty zones, with clever fading at the very limits is the best solution, you avoid tons of issues. And faster than you might think, finding a perfect gate or expander setting is never easy.

[garyb]

yes.

[nightscope]

editing the wave and cutting off the empty zones, with clever fading at the very limits is the best solution,

Agreed. Also with backing vox bounce them down with all the gunge and then do the fadein/outs on the stereo waveforms.

ns

[Neutron]

if you have a take with a noisy(hum especially) bit you can hear during a quiet part of the performance, you can find a bit of the hum where there is no performance happening and invert it, then nudge it back and forth while mixed with the vocal and you will find a place where the hum is almost completely gone.

it cancels out the hum but not the performance.

[dawman]

I thought for our backing vocal tracks it would be wise to rent some time at a local struggling studio, where I had access to more mics and mic pres as we use the headset/ear monitors live that have the Sennheiser diaphrams and they are designed to cut out background/stage sound insted of having the highest quality recording.
The tracks came out flawless using the GL 4800 console and some outboard API Modular designed gear, w/ an Earthworks SR-77.
We tried to add some more material recently using the FMR RNP 8380 and Heil PR40 into the A16U and chose to use a small heavily carpeted bedroom and it sucked. I then bought some used egg carton shaped foam for the ceiling and that sounded equally as bad.
I tried recording w/ a Gate as GaryB described and it ruined the sound.
I am learning the value of recording it right the first time.
But I do enjoy using certain effects in a chain, then followed by a Gate to clip the sound of the effect. This works well when you want a reverb or delay that has the right sound, but the tails are too long and muddy up the mix.
Just in the last month from taking advice from members here and doing my own experimentation using Expanders, Gates & Compressors w/ Sidechaining capabilities, my live mixes actually are starting to sound signature.
Since I am doing more mock ups of instruments lately these tricks are even more important.
I am looking forward to a really high quality Frequency keyed Gate since I lack the knowledge and patience to use Modular or chain several effects together. My project windows have no more room and too many cables.