I'm thinking about taking the plunge on a Scope system, maybe 6 DSP to start. I was initially thinking about the Solaris hardware synth, and may change my mind again, but Scope seems to fit into my setup better. This would be mostly for ambient and FX textures for film scoring. I have a few questions, though:
1. How do you load the synths? Is it a free-standing app, or do they load as VST plug-ins in a host? I currently have a PC running Plogue Bidule as a VST host for TASCAM GVI (GigaStudio plug-in) and Vienna Instruments. Could I add Scope plug-ins to this setup? (I'd probably build a second PC around it.)
2. Will 6 DSPs be enough to run a synth like Quantum Wave or Solaris, or do I need to step up to a 12 DSP system? You can upgrade to 12 later on with a daughterboard, right?
3. Are there any MP3 demos of Quantum Wave or Solaris? I could only find a few broken links for QW.
4. What is the Mac support? VST for Mac? I think I read that some plug-ins don't work on the Mac, so I'll probably keep it on one of my PC rigs.
Thanks for your help, -jl
Solaris Newbie Questions
I also have both synths and I agree with Stardust, he brought it pretty good to the point 
while 6 DSPs are a 'technically possible' entry for Solaris, they are almost useless for the QWave - it's 4 part multitimbral...
My 12 DSPs are barely enough for the more interesting stuff, so a 15 DSP card is a good suggestion as a starter, if you're interested in these devices.
Maybe a short look at the Solaris architecture makes it clearer:
the basic oscillator section has 2 parts, on which each can be assigned between 1 and 10(!) oscillators, followed by a 2 part filtersection with up to 4 filters per part, followed by a 4 part envelope and a 4 part LFO section...
this means that a single voice can have 20 oscillators mangled by 8 filters with (almost) everything cross-modulated.
You can chose from 35 filter types plus 2 extensions 'slots' for the RD module system, the CWA modular synth, Flexor and SpaceF extensions.
That's why even a mono voice can sound damn f*cking fat
for what you plan to do with it the Solaris is a perfect choice, there are even (full sets of) outstanding presets for that domain by Carl Loefgren and Benoist Guitton (to ease your start)
The QWave would be your first choice if you're (for whatever reason) in love with the famous Waldorf Wave, as it's probably the closest approach to bring it into the virtual domain.
Generally the Solaris is the more versatile choice, but I'm convinced that once you are familiar with it, you will want the QWave, too (as you extended your DSPs anyway...), be warned from the hidden addiction factor - it's a serious threat
cheers, Tom
while 6 DSPs are a 'technically possible' entry for Solaris, they are almost useless for the QWave - it's 4 part multitimbral...
My 12 DSPs are barely enough for the more interesting stuff, so a 15 DSP card is a good suggestion as a starter, if you're interested in these devices.
Maybe a short look at the Solaris architecture makes it clearer:
the basic oscillator section has 2 parts, on which each can be assigned between 1 and 10(!) oscillators, followed by a 2 part filtersection with up to 4 filters per part, followed by a 4 part envelope and a 4 part LFO section...
this means that a single voice can have 20 oscillators mangled by 8 filters with (almost) everything cross-modulated.
You can chose from 35 filter types plus 2 extensions 'slots' for the RD module system, the CWA modular synth, Flexor and SpaceF extensions.
That's why even a mono voice can sound damn f*cking fat
for what you plan to do with it the Solaris is a perfect choice, there are even (full sets of) outstanding presets for that domain by Carl Loefgren and Benoist Guitton (to ease your start)
The QWave would be your first choice if you're (for whatever reason) in love with the famous Waldorf Wave, as it's probably the closest approach to bring it into the virtual domain.
Generally the Solaris is the more versatile choice, but I'm convinced that once you are familiar with it, you will want the QWave, too (as you extended your DSPs anyway...), be warned from the hidden addiction factor - it's a serious threat
cheers, Tom
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synthetic88
- Posts: 134
- Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:48 am
Ouch, you need two of the big cards to get 8 voices of Solaris? Maybe I should wait for the next version with better DSP chips. Any rumors that's in the works?Consider a scope professional with 15 DSP for a start with these to Monster synths. I use 33 DSPs (on 3 stacked creamware boards in 3 PCI slots) and can reach 5-10 voices depending on the patch/preset.
I was searching everywhere for the basic "what is it" question. Now I understand (from your replies and from some review searches) that it's either a standalone app or a VST (through XTC). I'll dedicate a PC to it and some other VSTs. Will the standalone app host VSTis, or should I run the synths as VSTs in my current host?
Thanks for your replies. I was afraid that I'd need a Pro card for the Bowen monsters. Can someone post a sound file of Solaris to convince me that it's worth it?
Well Let Me Really Scare You,
I am using 2 x DAW's to house 2 x John Bowen synths. But they each deserve their own computer IMO.
I am a sick man who requires high polyphony counts on all synths, as I easily hit 7 notes on every chord, and hate the sound of a cut off in audio, so the 8th voice is basically my version of voice allocation.
I have Solaris, ProOne, and ProWave. And am dying for the FM beast which remains unfinished at this time. But I will give it a DAW if need be. My DAW's have 45 DSP's, 3 x 15's. But when you hear a Bowen synth w/ 8 voice poly, you will feel as though God himself has descended upon your rig. All other synths have great sounds and uses, but only devices made in Modular w/ Flexor, or Bowen synths can bring such elation. When Solaris in hardware arrives, I will devote a DAW to his FM beast, or QWave.
You could of course sound like most guys and use another synth from some other developers, but the sounds I get from his synths through proper amplification have no equal even in hardware, with the exception of Solaris in hardware. I believe that we will see all of John's synths in hardware in the upcoming years. If I have to live in a shanty to have them, then that is where I shall live.
Bowen Synths Are My Shepard, That I Shall Want,
They Maketh Me Compose In Green Pastures,
And Leadeth Me Beside Stable DAW's,
They Restoreth My Sound,
Yeah Though I Walk Through The Valley Of Weak VSTi's,
I Shall Fear No Emulations,
For JBowen Is With Me,
My Cards, And The Sonic Core Staff, They Comfort Me,
They Prepareth A Table Before Me, In The Presence Of My Enemies,
They Anointeth Me With Routings, My Daw's Runneth Over,
Surely FAT Synths Shall Follow Me All The Days Of My Life,
And I Shall Dwell In The House Of Bowen Forever.
Jahmen
Sorry if I get a trifle excited, but you would feel the same way.
There is no mp3 capable of transferring the FATness they create, just trust will bring you these obese sounds. I actually prefer that no one use them, that way I alone bring down the thunder.
I am using 2 x DAW's to house 2 x John Bowen synths. But they each deserve their own computer IMO.
I am a sick man who requires high polyphony counts on all synths, as I easily hit 7 notes on every chord, and hate the sound of a cut off in audio, so the 8th voice is basically my version of voice allocation.
I have Solaris, ProOne, and ProWave. And am dying for the FM beast which remains unfinished at this time. But I will give it a DAW if need be. My DAW's have 45 DSP's, 3 x 15's. But when you hear a Bowen synth w/ 8 voice poly, you will feel as though God himself has descended upon your rig. All other synths have great sounds and uses, but only devices made in Modular w/ Flexor, or Bowen synths can bring such elation. When Solaris in hardware arrives, I will devote a DAW to his FM beast, or QWave.
You could of course sound like most guys and use another synth from some other developers, but the sounds I get from his synths through proper amplification have no equal even in hardware, with the exception of Solaris in hardware. I believe that we will see all of John's synths in hardware in the upcoming years. If I have to live in a shanty to have them, then that is where I shall live.
Bowen Synths Are My Shepard, That I Shall Want,
They Maketh Me Compose In Green Pastures,
And Leadeth Me Beside Stable DAW's,
They Restoreth My Sound,
Yeah Though I Walk Through The Valley Of Weak VSTi's,
I Shall Fear No Emulations,
For JBowen Is With Me,
My Cards, And The Sonic Core Staff, They Comfort Me,
They Prepareth A Table Before Me, In The Presence Of My Enemies,
They Anointeth Me With Routings, My Daw's Runneth Over,
Surely FAT Synths Shall Follow Me All The Days Of My Life,
And I Shall Dwell In The House Of Bowen Forever.
Jahmen
Sorry if I get a trifle excited, but you would feel the same way.
There is no mp3 capable of transferring the FATness they create, just trust will bring you these obese sounds. I actually prefer that no one use them, that way I alone bring down the thunder.
A Scope Pro is worth in any case, not only for the Solaris that is great, but for some other stuff that is great as well, like the Modular synth with it's plaethora of proprietary and 3rd p. modules, like Adern's FleXor package (make a research on the forum about it...it's worth) a huge array of first class tools, tons of very good freeware and some unique routing capabilities of external and internal signals that give you unique power and control of your system.
no, with my 12 DSPs I get 8 voices with 3 Oscillators (2 multi-mode, 1 Wavetable), 1 filter and 2 lfo - you can run it reasonably well on a single 15 DSP card.synthetic88 wrote:...
Ouch, you need two of the big cards to get 8 voices of Solaris? ...
What I wanted to point out above is that (opposed to the usual VST stuff), a single Solaris voice can be extremely complex - and easily require more processing resources that a (simple) 32 voice VST.
As a rule of thumb you can (safely) assume that you achieve the same result in 'fatness' of tone with 1 third of the voices compared to a native VSTi with any Scope synth, because the sound engine really is that much more beefy.
Solaris in particular has the most complex voice architecture that I'm aware of - it just doesn't make sense to compare it's voice count to typical softsynths - this is hardware (like a Waldorf) at the convenience of software.
The Scope environment is a standalone application in which you arrange your virtual audio devices, synths, fx-processors, mixers in exactly the same way you would do with physical hardware in a studio - just the cables are virtual lines on the screen (and don't wear out... or are automatically plugged in and out when loading a 'project') - it's actually pretty simple if you've seen it once.
You can download the documentation from ftp://ftp.creamware.de/Manuals/SCOPE/Manual
cheers, Tom
I'll try to find back an audio demo nevertheless - but above you see what may happen if you start messing around with the system - it took Jimmy only one year to end as a confessing addict, no therapy in sight, but more DSPs and devices to ease the pain
here's another one for the QWave - it's 1of a set of 3 that made me buy the synth even though '...I don't need yet another one...'
the audio quality is significantly better than in the Solaris example - dunno if it's just the encoding or the sample rate (?)
cheers, Tom
the audio quality is significantly better than in the Solaris example - dunno if it's just the encoding or the sample rate (?)
cheers, Tom
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Wow, I liked what I heard concerning QWave.
Aren't you guys up a little late? It's 2300 hours where I am.
Yo' Mr. Synthetic 88,
You got the baddest MOFO's here dancing around to please ya'. If you don't buy a Pro card, and Solaris, I'll have you whacked by Tony Barbetta. I'm having him put together a remote controlled explosive device as we speak. It could be yours.
BTW, I use GS3 on the bottom DAW, and GVI on the DAW above that one. I beta tested two great instruments last month that are awesome. GViolin, and American Zither. Which can be played using DEF, iMIDI, etc. and performs similar to a pedal steel ( C6 ) w/ two pedals. You can't ask 4 a more stable combo to use live. SFP / GIGA DAW's kick the crap out of all these VSTi guys around town. The synths are FAT, and the samples are cleamer than a lean dick dog.
Aren't you guys up a little late? It's 2300 hours where I am.
Yo' Mr. Synthetic 88,
You got the baddest MOFO's here dancing around to please ya'. If you don't buy a Pro card, and Solaris, I'll have you whacked by Tony Barbetta. I'm having him put together a remote controlled explosive device as we speak. It could be yours.
BTW, I use GS3 on the bottom DAW, and GVI on the DAW above that one. I beta tested two great instruments last month that are awesome. GViolin, and American Zither. Which can be played using DEF, iMIDI, etc. and performs similar to a pedal steel ( C6 ) w/ two pedals. You can't ask 4 a more stable combo to use live. SFP / GIGA DAW's kick the crap out of all these VSTi guys around town. The synths are FAT, and the samples are cleamer than a lean dick dog.
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hubird
He makes the best keyboard cabinets around. I have been working with him for 15 years. He is another dedicated guy, as the picture demonstrates.
As soon as he was done posing, we brought all of the Mexicans back in to finish up.
Warning : Politically Incorrect joke .................
I can't believe the club is dead tonight. I asked a guy in the audience why he thought the place was dead. He said everyone went to the Commodores show. I thought those guys were all dead, or in nursing homes. Hell I can't even remember if it was Nixon, or Ford who was in office when they did their last record. Yeah that comment really made my night. This place sucks, thank God I raped the bandleader for 12 bens a week. I can't wait to get back to Vegas.
As soon as he was done posing, we brought all of the Mexicans back in to finish up.
Warning : Politically Incorrect joke .................
I can't believe the club is dead tonight. I asked a guy in the audience why he thought the place was dead. He said everyone went to the Commodores show. I thought those guys were all dead, or in nursing homes. Hell I can't even remember if it was Nixon, or Ford who was in office when they did their last record. Yeah that comment really made my night. This place sucks, thank God I raped the bandleader for 12 bens a week. I can't wait to get back to Vegas.
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synthetic88
- Posts: 134
- Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:48 am
Great stuff, thanks for the demos. I guess I'll be saving a bit more for the 15-chip card.
I don't use any VSTs besides Giga and VSL right now. Occasionally I'll boot up Atmosphere, which is what I want to replace since it's mainly a preset synth. I'll usually turn to my Andromeda or Super Jupiter for analog sounds. This would be for metallic, digital pads and weird effect textures. Sounds like that won't be much of a problem.
I've heard some of those GVI instruments -- I work for TASCAM. We've probably met. Where do you play in Vegas? I'll be there in a week.
I don't use any VSTs besides Giga and VSL right now. Occasionally I'll boot up Atmosphere, which is what I want to replace since it's mainly a preset synth. I'll usually turn to my Andromeda or Super Jupiter for analog sounds. This would be for metallic, digital pads and weird effect textures. Sounds like that won't be much of a problem.
I've heard some of those GVI instruments -- I work for TASCAM. We've probably met.
Where do you play in Vegas? I'll be there in a week.