A16 ultra level question

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:29 pm

When i output a tune from the optimaster at -0.1, i place it thru my drawmer mercenary edition at 0 threshold, and unity gain, and i find when i record the result in the vdat i find (i check in soundforge) it is aproximately -6 db, i wish the levels would remain the same as i don't use the drawmer to compress, but it seems i have to boost the output gain of my drawmer up 6db. so are my switches at the back of my a16 mirroring incorrectly?, or is the analog gear, what i want is just to pass thru the audio, but maintain the optimasters levels,
thankx, could garyb answer also?

Post by **garyb** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:50 pm

hmm, i don't know what you've got going on. first, i doubt if the drawmer pre is calibrated exactly to 0db, but assuming that it is, i'd say that the a16 is operating at -10 instead of +4.

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 7:31 am

I suggest you try a different dip-switch if you suspect it being mirrored wrong.

Else from http://www.jlmaudio.com/8packoftrans.htm:
---
# The list below shows some of the more common settings.
# +22dBM for Protools HD Protools 888 Yamaha 02R input Mackie HD System Mackie DXB-200
# +20dBM for Aark24 ESI Juli@ Apogee Rosetta 800 with internal jumpers set to match +20dBu
# +19dBM for RME Multiface and Fireface
# +18dBM for Protools 882 Digi001 Digi002 Paris MOTU896HD
# +15.1dBM for Hercules 16/12FW
# +10.8dBM for Creamware A16 MOTU 2408 mk II Alesis A13 (Needs 7dB pad)
----

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 10:18 am

I've only heard of people flipping the dip switch at the back of the a16 for meter reads.

Post by **garyb** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 12:22 pm

no, it's for level.

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 7:43 pm

right,the trick is to go out and in at the same levels. However it would be nice to maintain at 0.1db, not -10v or +4v for i/o, since i only use an outboard comp for passthru. sometimes i wish the unity gain and the threshold at 0 would enable the levels to stay the same, but going in and out of the a16 causes one to 'make up' when you go outboard

Post by **garyb** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 11:47 pm

audio gear(even the real high-end stuff) is not that standardized.

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 5:59 am

I say make-up with the Drawmer. You run stuff through it for colour don't you? Crank the bastard.

Post by **garyb** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 9:52 am

yep.
work with your ears, as well as your eyes and brain. if it sounds good, it is. if it doesn't sound good, skip it. if it doesn't do something special for you, don't bother, even if the gear in question is expensive..

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:08 pm

thankx, i do find the drawmer 68 merc edition with the big switch adds alot of beauty of depth and glue to the finished product, but common opinion is that its euphonic tone sometimes find it mushy , i find that if i crank the output stage it mushes up, does anybody find another comp useful in this, i hear the tube-tech does a better job (almost double the price, tho), any suggestions?

Post by **garyb** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:35 pm

optimaster?
vinco?
both pretty darn good and no need to go outside the box.
ditto stw mastering comps.

why do you need a compressor on the final mix? a properly used limiter can work wonders, even a cheap one, but an improperly used limiter will make poop even if it's expensive.

one nice thing about a multiband like optimaster is that you probably want to limit low freqs differently than mids and highs. a really good crossover and really nice limmiters will do the same job, but at a crazy price and requiring more skill.

actually, if you are unsure about the best use of such tools, you can take your finished mixes to a good mastering house and pay attention to how the engineer does his job, an education worth the money. when going to the mastering engineer, it's best to not have put a limiter on the whole mix anyway. be assured that as nice as the drawmer and it's ilk are, these are pretty coarse tools compared to what a true mastering room can offer.

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 9:58 am

i use all the creamware stuff, my tunes are all done via the opti, but the final touch, high end circuitry adds depth and roundness to the mix, the reason people buy external gr is for a gentle passthru, (the sharc chips via vdat recording also adds depth compared to wave dest.), maybe its just that little more i'm looking for in a mix which the drawmer gives me. I find in some mastering houses, all they use is protools, and it doesn't do much to the overall image we can get from cw, i'd like to try this last bit form brainworx to see if there is any improvement

Post by **garyb** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 12:11 pm

there's no problem with using the external gear!

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:11 am

Whenever going out to hardware you do add some noise/distortion, but it can be worth it.

My "mastering"-chain usually consists of FinaLiza -> GraphEQ (or other EQ) -> Vinco (RMS mode)

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 9:48 am

ya, if you go "out", make sure you have a good low noise comp, i go out a16 via adat, and back, i have actually gone from the SBC (after mix LR)into my ext. comp, then into the optimaster, i find that its ok. Because my goal was to get the analog "breath" from the ext device, i still find its somewhat maintained after going back into the opti for limiting. Otherwise you have to play witht the analog gr. The big question is if your actually making a cd with 1's and 0's in the end anyway, how can you really maintain that analog sound, i think its the final ad's in mastering, i hope the a16 and vdat fill that roll for me as many mastering houses just use protools anyway

Wired · Post by **Wired** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:11 pm

love the 68 drawmer, but am going to try the tfpro p38, it also has a m/s matrix in it. if its as good as the drawmer, i'll probably get it