scope card as slave clocked from external wordclock.
has this configuration been tested from anyone?
_________________
ELVIS LIVES
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 13:13 ]</font>
creamware cards on 192khz as slave?
you forget that the cards are NOT limited to audio processing in musical context.
Medical ultrasound measure of blood speed (for example) operates at 150khz (afaik). I would have loved to have such a system (including DP) around 1990.
You probably have no idea about the (usual) price range of such gear and tools - take what you know from audio and multiply with a factor between 5 and 10
cheers, Tom
Medical ultrasound measure of blood speed (for example) operates at 150khz (afaik). I would have loved to have such a system (including DP) around 1990.
You probably have no idea about the (usual) price range of such gear and tools - take what you know from audio and multiply with a factor between 5 and 10
cheers, Tom
not at all - I just wanted to point out that there is an attractive market segment that absolutely requires extremely high frequency rates.
of course this refers to the years when the cards were originally designed - but that's when they decided about the specs.
I really don't know if Creamware planned anything in (say) medical or scientific context back then, but those customers usually want their 30% off the list price - and then don't complain anymore. Easy to achieve if the base price is already increased 500% - no kidding, I've seen such deals happen
cheers, tom
of course this refers to the years when the cards were originally designed - but that's when they decided about the specs.
I really don't know if Creamware planned anything in (say) medical or scientific context back then, but those customers usually want their 30% off the list price - and then don't complain anymore. Easy to achieve if the base price is already increased 500% - no kidding, I've seen such deals happen
cheers, tom
well i have 20dsps, and i know that it is impossible to work with synths.
i just want to know if i can just use mixers and 1 or two effects.
i usually work on 24/48khz.
but what if i want to import a dvd-audio of 192khz file and work with it on nuendo for example?
something else that i am intersted in is to be able in the near future to record classical music by using 6 microphones recording 4 classical singers and a piano for example.
this i whould be very interested if i could record it on very high s/rates.
what do i have to do in that case?
is scope going to be unable to play with 192 khz being slave? no plugins just play with 1 mixer. and record instead to a dvd-audio via aes/ebu or inside the pc with recording tool.
i just want to know if i can just use mixers and 1 or two effects.
i usually work on 24/48khz.
but what if i want to import a dvd-audio of 192khz file and work with it on nuendo for example?
something else that i am intersted in is to be able in the near future to record classical music by using 6 microphones recording 4 classical singers and a piano for example.
this i whould be very interested if i could record it on very high s/rates.
what do i have to do in that case?
is scope going to be unable to play with 192 khz being slave? no plugins just play with 1 mixer. and record instead to a dvd-audio via aes/ebu or inside the pc with recording tool.
hmmm, maybe a problem, but there isn't much 192k dvd audio around.....
i suppose you could import it directly off the dvd, no? there is more to good sound than just high sample rates, but this may be a problem for you. if you must be that high-end, i suppose you'll just have to spend more like $40,000.
a thought... if you're going to have a high-end studio, the word clock is the thing, right? any high-end master clock that you choose can be used for a long time, no?(since word clock is word clock on every system) the syncplate is cheap. get a clock that does 192khz, get the syncplate and try it. the worst thing that can happen is that it doesn't work for you. in that case, you still have to get pt hd or similar, you can still clock all your studio to the same master and if you sell the scope, you'll lose very little of the cost of the syncplate. the master clock stays regardless.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-01-01 16:23 ]</font>
i suppose you could import it directly off the dvd, no? there is more to good sound than just high sample rates, but this may be a problem for you. if you must be that high-end, i suppose you'll just have to spend more like $40,000.
a thought... if you're going to have a high-end studio, the word clock is the thing, right? any high-end master clock that you choose can be used for a long time, no?(since word clock is word clock on every system) the syncplate is cheap. get a clock that does 192khz, get the syncplate and try it. the worst thing that can happen is that it doesn't work for you. in that case, you still have to get pt hd or similar, you can still clock all your studio to the same master and if you sell the scope, you'll lose very little of the cost of the syncplate. the master clock stays regardless.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-01-01 16:23 ]</font>
i really do not know but i would like some more help please.
192khz directly in the sequencer cannot be imported in nuendo when creamware is master because creamware does not give more than 96khz.
theoritically when it is slave to external clock(big ben etc) it can reach 192khz and even more as syncplate says so it is possible to work with that project via nuendo.
what i am asking exactly is how creamware software loads in that case? is it possible to work through routing window?
what about the classical recordings?
garyb, if i am not wrong you have written that you use nanoclocks that go up to 192khz.
have you tested this high and checked the behaviour of scopes environment?
_________________
ELVIS LIVES
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 16:39 ]</font>
192khz directly in the sequencer cannot be imported in nuendo when creamware is master because creamware does not give more than 96khz.
theoritically when it is slave to external clock(big ben etc) it can reach 192khz and even more as syncplate says so it is possible to work with that project via nuendo.
what i am asking exactly is how creamware software loads in that case? is it possible to work through routing window?
what about the classical recordings?
garyb, if i am not wrong you have written that you use nanoclocks that go up to 192khz.
have you tested this high and checked the behaviour of scopes environment?
_________________
ELVIS LIVES
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 16:39 ]</font>
maybe this would be better for a straight recording... http://aes.harmony-central.com/117AES/C ... A1000.html
i don't see a lot of dvd 192k stuff for sale, but i see a lot of hardware bragging about it. many of the discs i see for sale are outrageously expensive, but they really can't be that much more outrageously expensive to make. there's some snoberry involved more than music loving, i suspect....
no, i've never tried to work at that rate. none of the rest of my gear is happy at that samplerate. it seems that there are many cheap soundcards which claim to be happy at that samplerate by maudio and creative, but i'd rather work in scope at 44.1khz than on an maudio card at 192khz, just my opinion...
i think a call in to cwa is in order if you really need a firm answer before proceeding, after the holiday thing wears off...
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-01-01 16:45 ]</font>
i don't see a lot of dvd 192k stuff for sale, but i see a lot of hardware bragging about it. many of the discs i see for sale are outrageously expensive, but they really can't be that much more outrageously expensive to make. there's some snoberry involved more than music loving, i suspect....
no, i've never tried to work at that rate. none of the rest of my gear is happy at that samplerate. it seems that there are many cheap soundcards which claim to be happy at that samplerate by maudio and creative, but i'd rather work in scope at 44.1khz than on an maudio card at 192khz, just my opinion...
i think a call in to cwa is in order if you really need a firm answer before proceeding, after the holiday thing wears off...
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2006-01-01 16:45 ]</font>
yes, this tascam seems to be great.
i have to know if i can send there from scope via aes at 192khz with a good external clock as master.
and lets say that i do not use syncplate neither external clock.
how can i work with an 192khz wav in nuendo?
i mean that when scope is master and gives up to 96khz, this wav of 192khz is playedback slow motion.
there must be a setting to make nuendo master and scope slave or something, and then to be able to send audio singal to my amplifier. (is this called working internally?)
_________________
ELVIS LIVES
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 17:08 ]</font>
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 17:08 ]</font>
i have to know if i can send there from scope via aes at 192khz with a good external clock as master.
and lets say that i do not use syncplate neither external clock.
how can i work with an 192khz wav in nuendo?
i mean that when scope is master and gives up to 96khz, this wav of 192khz is playedback slow motion.
there must be a setting to make nuendo master and scope slave or something, and then to be able to send audio singal to my amplifier. (is this called working internally?)
_________________
ELVIS LIVES
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 17:08 ]</font>
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ARCADIOS on 2006-01-01 17:08 ]</font>
Arcadios, read this quote from Sound on Sound :
"The most obvious thing to send to a CD mastering house is a 16-bit/44.1kHz Red Book audio CD-R, but there are various other options. Nearly all will still accept DAT tapes, while another option is to burn a CD-ROM containing stereo 24-bit WAV or AIFF files. One big advantage of this approach is that you can also send in your files at sample rates other than 44.1kHz, most popularly at 96kHz, so that the mastering engineer gets the best possible chance of retaining audio quality until the very last stage of the proceedings. You can now even send your WAV fies over secure Internet links direct to some mastering houses.
Sample rates of up to 96kHz are also directly supported by DVD-Audio for surround purposes, which will interest those PC musicians whose multitrack applications already have surround-sound features. However, the only 'project-studio' priced DVD-Audio authoring package I've come across is Minnetonka's Discwelder Steel (reviewed in SOS March 2003), which only supports file formats up to 24-bit/48kHz for 5.1 surround tracks. DVD-A also supports stereo file formats up to 24-bit/192kHz, but I don't know of any PC authoring application that currently supports this.
So, while you may find 24-bit/96kHz recordings capture the last drop of detail, you're still likely to have to downsample in most cases to 44.1kHz before sending off your final product, in which case 88.2kHz might be a more appropriate starting point."
Interesting points regarding 192kHz sample rates towards the end there (highlighted in bold) The article is 2 years old tho
It's from an article about mastering on your PC, which is <a href="http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug03/a ... m">HERE</a>
"The most obvious thing to send to a CD mastering house is a 16-bit/44.1kHz Red Book audio CD-R, but there are various other options. Nearly all will still accept DAT tapes, while another option is to burn a CD-ROM containing stereo 24-bit WAV or AIFF files. One big advantage of this approach is that you can also send in your files at sample rates other than 44.1kHz, most popularly at 96kHz, so that the mastering engineer gets the best possible chance of retaining audio quality until the very last stage of the proceedings. You can now even send your WAV fies over secure Internet links direct to some mastering houses.
Sample rates of up to 96kHz are also directly supported by DVD-Audio for surround purposes, which will interest those PC musicians whose multitrack applications already have surround-sound features. However, the only 'project-studio' priced DVD-Audio authoring package I've come across is Minnetonka's Discwelder Steel (reviewed in SOS March 2003), which only supports file formats up to 24-bit/48kHz for 5.1 surround tracks. DVD-A also supports stereo file formats up to 24-bit/192kHz, but I don't know of any PC authoring application that currently supports this.
So, while you may find 24-bit/96kHz recordings capture the last drop of detail, you're still likely to have to downsample in most cases to 44.1kHz before sending off your final product, in which case 88.2kHz might be a more appropriate starting point."
Interesting points regarding 192kHz sample rates towards the end there (highlighted in bold) The article is 2 years old tho
It's from an article about mastering on your PC, which is <a href="http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug03/a ... m">HERE</a>
My guess is that it works fine, but it would be rather futile because of DSP usage (some devices must stay on 1 dsp, and when the sample rate is that high there's just not enough space on the chip).
My advice - forget about samplerate pissing contests and make some music instead. Either way, if you don't have a high-resolution master clock capable of testing this feature yourself, then you simply do not need it.
My advice - forget about samplerate pissing contests and make some music instead. Either way, if you don't have a high-resolution master clock capable of testing this feature yourself, then you simply do not need it.
i will buy a good clock and will try myself.
but i wanted to know the experience of the ones that have worked this way.
you talk about dsp usage and modules that cannot share dsps.
about synths i do not really care cause i know that they do well on 44.1 and 48khz only.
mixers is what matters when clocked at 192khz and some effects maybe, together with the basic asio modules and some other io's.
but i wanted to know the experience of the ones that have worked this way.
you talk about dsp usage and modules that cannot share dsps.
about synths i do not really care cause i know that they do well on 44.1 and 48khz only.
mixers is what matters when clocked at 192khz and some effects maybe, together with the basic asio modules and some other io's.
Re: creamware cards on 192khz as slave?
yea, so how is it?
scope driver is also missing 88.2KHz sample rate selection
i conducted an experiment: set scope to slave and input 88,2 or even 192K through optical, set sync source to s/mux
everything works, i can hear the sound through scope's digital output and see although display is wrong (showing 48 or 96K).
at 88.2 everything's correct via s/mux - i get two channels through s/mux source module, but when I switch to 192, i get 4 channels because s/mux module doesn't understand quadruple rate.
so my suggestions would be:
1. add 88,2KHz sample rate to driver's selection, because the card can handle (generate) it itself - now it's only 44, 48 and 96 - why omit 88?;
2. make the driver and input s/mux modules aware of 176 and 192 sample rates when in slave mode. quadruple rate would give 2 channels via one optical s/mux channel. having 176 and 192 [slave] options would enable digital signal input and output to/from software programs without need of resampling, provided one has an external clock.
if analog i/o doesn't work at high rates, it's no problem, because 'onboard' converters ain't that great anyway and scope's strength is in routing. some scope cards don't have analog at all by the way
176 and 192K inclusion would make scope cards up to date and hand in hand with the best!
scope driver is also missing 88.2KHz sample rate selection
i conducted an experiment: set scope to slave and input 88,2 or even 192K through optical, set sync source to s/mux
everything works, i can hear the sound through scope's digital output and see although display is wrong (showing 48 or 96K).
at 88.2 everything's correct via s/mux - i get two channels through s/mux source module, but when I switch to 192, i get 4 channels because s/mux module doesn't understand quadruple rate.
so my suggestions would be:
1. add 88,2KHz sample rate to driver's selection, because the card can handle (generate) it itself - now it's only 44, 48 and 96 - why omit 88?;
2. make the driver and input s/mux modules aware of 176 and 192 sample rates when in slave mode. quadruple rate would give 2 channels via one optical s/mux channel. having 176 and 192 [slave] options would enable digital signal input and output to/from software programs without need of resampling, provided one has an external clock.
if analog i/o doesn't work at high rates, it's no problem, because 'onboard' converters ain't that great anyway and scope's strength is in routing. some scope cards don't have analog at all by the way
176 and 192K inclusion would make scope cards up to date and hand in hand with the best!