Can Scope do a lush pad like this?

[Wired]

can one use flexor 3 in johns synths?

[husker]

apparently he will be licensing Flexor modules - so yes! (but not in modular style roll your own way)..but you will be able to choose a nice Flexor filter for example

[dawman]

Check it out. www.zargmusic.com

[slammah2012]

exactly right ....most people don't really care about poly AT and are not prepared to pay for it (as it is not cheap)

John Bowen also mentioned on his forum that they would like to do poly AT in the Solaris , but there is no poly AT keyboard bed available to use (he is using a Fatar unit)

Ha............ .....most people by a keyboard or get one as a gift and forget about it 3 weeks later...that is what the manufactures rely on....

People that do give a shit about polyAT are the ones who have used it or had access to it before......It is by far the most intuitive control feature ever invented . Equalling Velocity and surpassing it in some instances......everything else like benders sliders wheels and joysticks take hands off the key surface, ...Why do People want these bells and whistles??? They are a visible asset to a salesperson.....Poly AT is hidden under the keys and is hard to explain to a "PolyAT Newbie".......but, Who actually fkkin cares about the performer and performance after it is sold??????????

[slammah2012]

i'm sure the Solaris' expressive capabilities and sound generation will be far in advance of anything by Arturia - there stuff really is overrated - and you know that with John Bowen you can directly contact him with ideas.

You can also contact Arturia.....

I suggested 3 corrections on the original CS80v to make it more authentic to my yamaha CS80, They listened and they fixed them in ver1.2 and ver1.5......

1 The CS80 ribbon response was the first fix, 2 the operation of sustain I with regard to "pitch" at the time of release feature, 3 Corrections in the Ring modulator EG.............

[husker]

it's both a keyboard and synth/software....although I have a poly AT keyboard, I don't use it as the only synth I have that supports it is the CS80V, which I don't use anymore...

there's no demand for poly AT keyboard because very few synths (from this century) support it and no demand for synths that support poly AT as no keyboards (from this century) support it...

plus then there is the issue of host not supporting poly AT, and the fact that is it very difficult to manage from a UI point of view and it floods an already clogged midi channel...

and to be honest my keyboard skills aren't up to getting any meaningful poly AT expression when compared to channel AT (i would much rather keep the ribbon controller on my A6 than gain a poly AT keyboard bed)

[slammah2012]

it's both a keyboard and synth/software....although I have a poly AT keyboard, I don't use it as the only synth I have that supports it is the CS80V, which I don't use anymore...

there's no demand for poly AT keyboard because very few synths (from this century) support it and no demand for synths that support poly AT as no keyboards (from this century) support it... (bullshit)

plus then there is the issue of host not supporting poly AT , and the fact that is it very difficult to manage from a UI point of view and it floods an already clogged midi channel...

and to be honest.......umm... my keyboard skills aren't up to getting any meaningful poly AT expression when compared to channel AT (i would much rather keep the ribbon controller on my A6 than gain a poly AT keyboard bed)

Wahhh
here's what you do...
Sell your polyAT keyboard on Ebay....make sure you mention PolyAT ....come back later and say there is no demand for it............
Open your eyes sometime.........
there are many softsynths and hardware synths that can receive polyAftertouch messages....manufactured after 2000....If you don't know how to use it, just say so, but don't come across as a simple thing saying that polyphonic Aftertouch is not sought after.....It is us who will "release you of your dreaded polyAT control"feature so some day you can live free in the land of M-audio pitch wheels, axis pads and joysticks..........bleckkkkk

[husker]

can you give me the list of synths that support poly AT + the list of hosts that support it...i'm interested, really

[slammah2012]

Yes I can, I compiled a list a year ago with a few other PolyAT users on a different forum.......I will find that board and paste the findings here,

you also mentioned the Newer hardware boards from Alesis that receive poly AT so I will add those and the Origins and the Solaris based on John's statement:

I don't think I ever said the Solaris would not handle poly AT over MIDI, or that it was too expensive - john bowen

[wayne]

Wouldn't mind hearing some poly AT - got anything you can post, slammah?

[johnbowen]

Poly AT is a fantastic feature - extremely expressive and fun to use! When we developed the T-8 way 'back in the day', it was the first time I had a chance to really work with it (not having played a CS-80 but for a few minutes at a trade show), and I agree that it's a terrific feature. Some keyboard players complained that they had to change their playing style, as they weren't used to pressing down on individual keys with different pressures, but to me it was the most natural thing.

We at Sequential were quite surprised that more users didn't rave about the control, but, it obviously wasn't that important to many, especially considering the extra cost incurred to have such a nice keyboard (to be fair, it wasn't just the polyphonic AT that added to the cost - a fully weighted 76 key wood keyboard with hammer action was quite fancy as well. The other additional cost factor for the T-8 was that each sensor on each key had to be manually adjusted for the aftertouch response, one by one, which added to the cost of manufacturing in terms of time/labor).

I don't recall the CS-80 retail price, but it wasn't cheap. the T-8 retailed for around $6,200 (in 1983 dollars). The DX1 mentioned was quite expensive ($13,900 in 1985 dollars), and there was the 1984 version of the Synclavier II that licensed the T-8 keyboard from Sequential (we needed to amortize the cost of the keyboard, and were happy to have New England Digital as a customer), which was also quite expensive ($25,000 - $200,000). (Also, the Haken board mentioned elsewhere - a full length controller surface for $5290 + $300~ for a case, just really puts these things beyond most typical users.)

I've never tried the Ensoniq or Roland boards with Poly AT, but the Kurzweil Midiboard seemed nice enough (a controller only, retail $2495) .

Now days, any manufacturer who offers poly AT must be making (or have some control over the manufacture of) their own keybeds. There's certainly not any available for me to buy to put in the Solaris, otherwise, I would agree with slammah - it's a wonderful, expressive feature.

cheers,
john b.

p.s. I don't think many people know this - I was present at a private display of the original Synclavier given by Jon Appleton for Moog Music. It was in a hotel room at the Chicago NAMM show, and Norlin Industries (who had recently bought Moog) were asking us if we thought they should buy it and bring it out as a new Moog synth! Everyone was quite surprised, because from what I remember, it was almost a done deal, and we at Moog had heard nothing about it! (Obviously, things didn't work out...)

[synthetic88]

Great story. (It will be on Matrixsynth in ten minutes. )

I've wondered lately why no one makes a high-end MIDI controller. There seems to be a market for such a thing.

[dawman]

Someday a unit with multiple LCD's, and POLY AT will surface, but believe me, most young players thesedays are not interested. It's stictly a niche item. But if performance features with samplers keeps increasing, we might hear the " smyphonic guys' start asking for it as well. Even when playing ancient crappy strings it was so nice to have the note of your choice in a chord to stand out, or as in the Ensoniq's case bend that pitch through pressure while others remain unaffected. Perfect choice for a good Pedal Steel for sure. I have a developer working on just such a library. I am hoping Wavelore rescues me. Just imagine holding a 5 voice Solaris chord, then make the note of your choice do your choice of tricks, not only volume, but modulation, PB,etc.

[slammah2012]

Wouldn't mind hearing some poly AT - got anything you can post, slammah?

OK here are some examples of my SQ-80 controlling a synth...be prepared..
I am using Polyphonic aftertouch...nothing else, live, 1 midi channel , 1 user patch

hope these links work


http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/b64a71031225/audio.html

http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/126bb1031243/audio.html

http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/e82a31031186/audio.html

[slammah2012]

Wouldn't mind hearing some poly AT - got anything you can post, slammah?

OK here are some examples of my SQ-80 controlling a synth...be prepared..
I am using Polyphonic aftertouch...nothing else, live, 1 midi channel , 1 user patch

hope these links work


http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/b64a71031225/audio.html

http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/126bb1031243/audio.html

http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/e82a31031186/audio.html

(there is a couple of spots where my pedal sw adds portamento and in number 3, a bit of pitch bend (SUS 1 type) where pitch at release is displayed)
There are no Reverbs on this...

[wayne]

Yeah good stuff slammah.

Nice realm of expansion for a keyboardist, indeed. Whole new set of chops

[astroman]

I assume slammah used the patch as a convenient way to show the capabilities of individual note control - and it would be perdfectly ok in the context of synth sound generation.
But as an attempt to fake 'classical' expressiveness it's embarrassing to say at least, like General Midi goes Opera

He's a much better live keyboarder in his rock band

cheers, Tom
(no need to worry, I know I'm a bit dogmatic in this context, as with the violin samples...)

[wayne]

Cheesy, true

As a brass player, i tend to like synths to stick to their own bag

These clips show what it can do, tho - got any hard rockin poly AT there slammah?

[slammah2012]

Yeah....I can dig out some....... most of it comes out live on the fly though....
polyAT is such a simple control to use , and if you assign it to filters amps and
LFO's , it spontaneously gives you what your looking for.......balance can be tricky though with leslie speed sw cross fade, and volume under right foot and all the Sustain pedals under the left...
http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/d533e1038642/audio.html

As a brass player, i tend to like synths to stick to their own bag

I did.....this was polyphonic AT control of a polysynth preset........
At no time did I play monophonically as a brass player would,
perhaps you interpret it as such , however I have yet to hear a trumpeteer blow a solid chord out of his horn.....except in traffic

[slammah2012]

I assume slammah used the patch as a convenient way to show the capabilities of individual note control - and it would be perdfectly ok in the context of synth sound generation.
But as an attempt to fake 'classical' expressiveness it's embarrassing to say at least, like General Midi goes Opera

He's a much better live keyboarder in his rock band

cheers, Tom
(no need to worry, I know I'm a bit dogmatic in this context, as with the violin samples...)

...........http://audio.xanga.com/slammah/d533e1038642/audio.html


I was asked in an earlier post if I could display an example of polyAT.....that was what it was.....I basically opened a Soft synth and played them out of my head on the spot, changing presets.......10 min for the 3 of them, kinda rushed it
I am sorry you mistook the polyphonic aftertouch control of a soft-polysynth as 'classical' expressiveness .....if that was your interpretation of it.....
I made 1 patch, and the other was a factory.......i also wanted to show pitch bend with it but will show that another time.....when i am not so busy.