Mac or PC?

fortner · Post by **fortner** » Mon Jul 05, 2004 5:30 pm

Hi,

I'm working with two pc-systems (PIII 1000MHz and P4 2GHz) with Intel-based-motherboards, all tweaked and imho well prepared as DAW, but there are a lot of problems: IRQ, PCI-capacity, crackles, noise etc.
It's possible to configure a perfect working pc, but it is a lot of work (testing hardware, changing pci-slots etc. - you'll know it).

My question:

Do you have the same problems on a Mac (f.e. G4 800MHz) or are the problems features

of the pc-platform?

Who knows both systems? Do I get less or more grey hairs changing to a Mac?

Thanks and bye

Christian

_________________
From Hamburg / Germany

[ This Message was edited by: fortner on 2004-07-05 18:33 ]

borg · Post by **borg** » Mon Jul 05, 2004 6:12 pm

installation wise, i think macs are far more friendly.
scope on mac does miss quite some little handy features, and has it's small flaws. but basically it runs as great as on a pc.

less gray hairs, less power, or more money spent.
macs are definitely not from utopia, but do give you the opportunity to be a slacker and not care too much about your system

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Mon Jul 05, 2004 6:36 pm

Very few grey hairs here.

Of course the main problem is you have to get an OS9 G4 (first model) otherwise it's a non-starter for the software and also a pain to fit more than one card in the later G4s (mine's OK though). Other than that all i've done to my Mac is switch off any unnecessary extensions and love it - and i've got a 500MHz single processor.

i bought it before PIII came out and am still happy with it - how many PII owners are still happy with their PCs as DAWs? (ducks)

Mr A

PS. There are lots of people with good PC systems so there'sno reason you shouldn't be able to get it up and running - keep hassling the PC gurus here, they love it

[ This Message was edited by: Mr Arkadin on 2004-07-05 19:39 ]

valis · Post by **valis** » Mon Jul 05, 2004 11:00 pm

Honestly I've not really had any issues with my pc & creamware cards, and I even have an RME card in as well.

Also I've run XP in standard & ACPI modes and not really noticed any gains in standard so I stick with ACPI for its added flexibility.

Of course I've used mac/pc/sgi/sun etc and you must realize they all have their headaches as well as upsides...a computer is a computer regardless of who is evangelizing it.

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

well, I wouldn't call it evangelizing...
Fortner has a very specific problem with a certain concept of system design.

And since it's not about the latest and greatest Macs (and their respective OS), but about the workhorses of the G4 generation running a 'classic' OS there is in fact a difference.

Those machines don't have configuration problems because there isn't anything to configure.
They have a fairly effective hardware architecture providing much more power than the clockrate suggests.

But the main point is the lack of a registry in MacOS-9.
Important stuff for 'system' use is put in a special folder and preloaded when booting.
That's all - you stay in control.
If something goes wrong, just move that stuff from the folder and reboot.

A program installation is nothing more than dragging a folder to a harddisk on a Mac. There's no registry...
The install of a new OS doesn't need any applications to be reinstalled.
You could copy a running MacOS-9 to a different HD and boot another machine from this disk...

That's about the (simplyfied) concept of the 'pure' MacOS - but when suppliers from the so-called 'PC-market' discovered the Mac they did bring a good deal of their usual style of doing things - and messing them up

Like filename specific programming, overuse of the system folder, installers (!), etc.
Creamware itself is a good example of bad programming style and they are in good company with Oracle and M$soft and most Scanner/Printer suppliers...
Most problems (or annoyances) with Mac applications have their source somewhere in this domain, but basic hardware and software configuration (as requested in this thread)simply lacks the typical problems of the WinTel world.
Btw I refer to machines up to the 'Quicksilver' series, afaik built pre 2002 and capable of booting MacOS-9.

Of course this has changed significantly since Apple jumped the UX train, but that's another topic.

cheers, Tom

valis · Post by **valis** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:09 am

Wasn't accusing anyone specifically of evangelizing, its just that every platform tends to have zealots and threads like this are similar to logic vs. cubase vs. etc discussions. Which isn't to say they're pointless, but imo you're better off asking yourself what you want to do/what tools you need and working from there than worrying about what theoretical tools are 'better' and working backwards to what you can do with it.

Mind you I learned irq's when I was 11 with a compaq luggable (mapping dma addresses was more fun) and I also remember swapping extensions and control panels like mad pre-osX to find conflicts. Incidentally I don't have my G4 anymore but I will probably have a G5 at some point because I'm a logic 'fan' and at that point I expect to wire it to the pulsar in my pc via adat.

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 1:44 pm

On 2004-07-07 09:09, valis wrote:
Wasn't accusing anyone specifically of evangelizing, ...

oops, that wasn't intended by me, too. I used that intro as a kind of excuse for myself not to be messed with the Apple evangelists

But since not all users can have a decade or more of experience with a certain system, I just wanted to point out from what that 'Apple is more simple to deal with...' originates.
I completely agree with your opinion that it's just a tool and everyone has to pick the ones that fits his or her needs best.

On one point I'm evangelizing, though - don't believe in numbers

cheers, Tom

valis · Post by **valis** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 5:25 am

On 2004-07-07 14:44, astroman wrote:
oops, that wasn't intended by me, too. I used that intro as a kind of excuse for myself not to be messed with the Apple evangelists

Btw another distinction, at least in the Drum&Bass arena is that PC's are seen as 'entry level' and Macs are almost required for studio shots in magazines etc. or you'll be forced to explain yourself

In the favor of PC's we're of the opinion that Apple is a bit tight with controlling the level of aftermarket customizeability of the OS (changing look/feel/operation) without digging into the guts of the OS. On the PC side there's quite a few options (with the requisite stability issues if you stray too experimental of course).

DJ Mosley · Post by **DJ Mosley** » Sun Jul 11, 2004 4:07 pm

I plan to switch to PC from Mac. HuiDrums by D-Mute has pushed me over the edge. I really want to use it and it won't work for Mac. I really have grown to like my Scope synths more than my Mac itself and it seems that PC is more the format that I really want. As soon as I research and find the proper PC to replace my Dual 1.25 ghz G4, the G4's going to be listed on eBay.

Post by **hubird** » Sun Jul 11, 2004 5:17 pm

[ This Message was edited by: hubird on 2004-07-12 09:01 ]

R-type · Post by **R-type** » Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:15 am

Dunno about the drum n bass thing, the only local producers I've had any contact with use PCs. Even Fruity Loops! (Concorde Dawn).

In years past it was all about your EMU sampler anyway.

maakbow · Post by **maakbow** » Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:41 pm

"preach it brother"