sick of all the bullshit!

Sam Glass · Post by **Sam Glass** » Fri Jul 20, 2001 3:22 am

Ok. I thought you'd have to do some sort of transformation into the frequency domain, check out what dominant freq was there, shift the spectrum a bit if it's out of tune, then transform back. I guess I should check out how its really done but I can't be arsed.

Do you know Apollo?

PabloFasan · Post by **PabloFasan** » Fri Jul 20, 2001 8:16 pm

I had the doubtful honour of to be the first user that was kicked out from Creamware's support forum, for mantaining a public discussion with Frank Hund's boys in this forum near two years ago.

So with this solid experience over my shoulders , I think that I have some authority for to say some things:

1) The main problem of Creamware is not of a technologic nature, is the attitude that they have to the users: ARROGANT

2) This type of attitude generates the type of reactions that we see in the precedent posts.

3)Probably there's no other company that has done a so complex technologic developement for computer's music.
Remember that's the only enviroment that allows you to run multiple programs at the same time and in perfect sync (audio & MIDI).

4) Complexity is not a value by itself, also it must be friendly and useful for musical purposes. This is a point in where CW's team lose many times the correct way.

5) At the begining of Pulsar it was presented as a "Multitrack Recording Enviroment" and not as a "virtual synth enviroment" , so it's main purpose was RECORDING.

The original versions of the pulsar synths where more like examples of other possible applications that Scope technology could have, but it was mainly a recording enviroment.

6) Trying to satisfy everybody, musicians, DJs, producers, composers, experienced and begginer people, CW don't satisfy to nobody.

Finally they convert this in a sort of Babel Tower, where each one speak in it's own language without understanding that the own needs are different from those of the other.

7) With the develope of ASIO technology and mainly with the release by Steinberg and NI of the virtual VST synths , CW change their product's target and begin to give more and more importance to this area, forgetting the previous compromises that they had with people that purchase Pulsars for recording purposes.

One clear example of this is the NEVER UPGRADED MIDI implementation, that continue more or less identical than in version 1.0.

No other automation system was proposed for the Big mixer, leaving this type of users without an important, necessary and promised tool.

They replaced also the very solid, professional and hi-fi A16 for this toy box called Luna that requires moreover a special board.

For this and many other contradictory decisions, nobody could feel surprised if this type of nasty discussions appear from time to time.

topbanana · Post by **topbanana** » Mon Jul 23, 2001 3:47 am

It there any way someone could email this thread to CW and then continue to do so on a once a week basis until they post something to make us feel more comfortable with their support and development ???

Cheers

Nigel.

ohmelas · Post by **ohmelas** » Sun Jul 29, 2001 5:45 am

Hey Guys,

This all seems a bit nieve. It was only five years ago that we could finally record four-tracks of audio into our computers and that was a big deal unless of course you shelled out thousands for Pro Tools 2 or 3.

CW has released a great product with great features and in many respect their development has a ways to go. at other software products. Cubase is now at what, 5.0 and how about Logic? When CW users are at that stage in the game considering their phasing their development for a usable product now and an even more usable product later, we'll be able to more effectively complain about what it doesn't do then.

What my Pulsar does for me now is make decent sounds. I use it as an I/O for Cubase and haven't had the crashes you've all explained. I use it as an I/O for Cakewalk Sonar and haven't had the problems---except I can only get 12-14 tracks of audio out of Cakewalk--I was told thats a windows limitation of the MME extentions.

I also use the synths. Right out of the box they give me a lot of analog and I use the sampler for most of my work. It works great and runs right out of my PC into a digital mixer where I don't have to worry about the mixer problems in Pulsar.

So for me, it works. I wish it worked better because, like every one else here I'm hoping for more. It's the American Way dudes and thank goodness we have a decent product that's going somewhere. When do you all think they'll start to use the new SHARC DSP's at 150Mhz or 200Mhz? They're really really fast and just as cheap.

Best Wishes to All,

Howard

screech · Post by **screech** » Mon Jul 30, 2001 7:48 am

Hi,

i love my pulsari+pulsarII+scopesrb system...
all my old synths even the juno60 is not connected to my audio system anymore...
i never got a fatter sound and produced more innovate music since i got my pulsar i card before 2 years (ver 1.0 !!!!)

i really don`t understand the problems you have with the sound... maybe you are not experienced enough... i would suggest to download some great modII devices or huicolity effects devices (or manymanymany others)... sure you cannot compare to protools tdm plugin but they cost 500$ or more....

and at last everything is relative and subjective... if you are not happy with you card sell it but don`t write such crap in a pulsar forum...

the only native based device i use is the evp77 this rhodes emulation... but all other native plugs are making the system unstable or creating timing problems...

and by the way if you have record deals or not does not make a experienced producer or not... your music is the key...

listen to what is possible with pulsar
we used it for live production :
http://www.mp3.com/mirrorcube
also
http://www.mp3.com/SGR

listen to the filters of clubhit... everything is pulsar...

greetings

Air_PoLLo · Post by **Air_PoLLo** » Mon Jul 30, 2001 2:03 pm

On 2001-07-30 08:48, screech wrote:

sure you cannot compare to protools tdm plugin but they cost 500$ or more....

What do you mean?

I use Pulsar connected to a RAMSA 24Bit digital desk. It has ADAT lightpipes and I get better results without ProTools system. The plugins on the Pulsar are a bit thin, I know but Have you ever seen the DSP's in the MIX24 plus ? It's less than my 2 Pulsar II's. At least it looks like it.

Also, the Synths in Pulsar are jst as good as Nordlead, Supernova, Roland.... trust me, I use them at the studio. One of the fattest sound I've heard was archieved using the free TB303 (orange looking thing) ehhe

Btw, I use the Pulsar on one of our mac's.

Take care sir, and please Protools is way overrated. The only GOOD thing are all the plugins avail

eeheh I just wish I could use more of them simultaniously

One interesting thing is that the algoriths are almost identical on a TDM plug as one VST dito.

Protools have only a good I/O interface, but it's overpriced. Apogee have better solutions at the same price..

I think it's a pitty that ProTools is standard in the music industry, we're forced to use it in order to work with the same project with others.

Oh, well let's hope better solutions are on it's way... like v.3 mixer with stereo faders

Cheers!

[ This Message was edited by: Air_PoLLo on 2001-07-30 15:07 ]

Air_PoLLo · Post by **Air_PoLLo** » Mon Jul 30, 2001 2:09 pm

On 2001-07-30 08:48, screech wrote:

sure you cannot compare to protools tdm plugin but they cost 500$ or more....

What do mean?

I use Pulsar connected to a RAMSA 24Bit digital desk. It has ADAT lightpipes and I get better result than with out ProTools system. (Have you ever seen the DSP's in the MIX24 plus ? It's less than my 2 Pulsar II's. At least it looks like it.

Also, the Synths in Pulsar are jst as good as Nordlead, Supernova, Roland.... trust me, I use them at the studio. One of the fattest sound was archieved using the free TB303 (orange looking thing) ehhe

Btw, I use the Pulsar on one of our mac's.

Take care sir, and please Protools is way overrated. The only GOOD thing are all the plugins avail

eeheh I just wish I could more of them.

One interesting thing is that the algoriths are almost identical on a TDM as VST.

The sound is processed equally good on auto-tune (VST plug and TDM plug)

Protools have only a good I/O interface, but it's overpriced. Apogee have better solutions at the same price..

I think it's a pitty that ProTools is standard in the music industry, we're forced to use it in order to work with the same project as others.

Oh, well let's hope better solutions are on it's way... like v.3 mixer with stereo faders

Cheers!

Mo · Post by Mo » Tue Jul 31, 2001 5:19 am

One interesting thing is that the algoriths are almost identical on a TDM as VST.
The sound is processed equally good on auto-tune (VST plug and TDM plug)

maybe. but certainly it´s a fact that the best plugins are written for tdm or mas... and not for vst and dx.
with protools you also pay for the ability to use the best software out there.

Post by **garyb** » Tue Jul 31, 2001 5:52 pm

if you can't do worthy work with pulsar and say,logic audio,you need to learn your gear or study music s'more or both or spend millions on a state of the art facility(c'mon now, euphonics or the new sony board, world-class mic pres,manley neumann etc. no BULLSHIT) or block out time in a state of the art facility or give up or try harder but you don't have to try to bum out the rest of us who enjoy the fact that we can finally do "radio ready" work for real for cheap.let's keep focused, people.if the music's good the sounds can be any old way and it's a hit.(check your history)if the music is shitty the best sounds won't make anyone really care.good music is that which connects with the listener in such a way as to speak.(c'mon even the engineers know about that magic something)if a fine guitarist picks up a cheap guitar,he still makes wonderful music.if one with no skill picks up a fine guitar,the sound is not pleasant. pulsar sounds good enough to SELL the music made on it.let's get back to making music and when there are discoveries or problems,helping others to make music.
amen

Mo · Post by Mo » Wed Aug 01, 2001 9:35 am

if a fine guitarist picks up a cheap guitar,he still makes wonderful music.if one with no skill picks up a fine guitar,the sound is not pleasant.

but you will agree that the first guitarist would be happier with a more precious instrument, and the second one (at least if he´s motivated and talented anough) would be happy for some time to have something that doesn´t limit him, but vice versa...

don´t judge the all-human wish for "MORE"... otherwise we all would still climb around in the trees...
stay hungry

Mo

_________________

da peppi connection! music and video feeds at <a href="http://www.peppisworld.de">http://www.peppisworld.de</a>

[ This Message was edited by: Mo on 2001-08-01 10:36 ]

Air_PoLLo · Post by **Air_PoLLo** » Wed Aug 01, 2001 2:34 pm

Mo:

Well, I always end up using Logic instead of ProTools software, ProTools have too many flaws atm.

Mo · Post by Mo » Wed Aug 01, 2001 2:51 pm

which of plug-in formats are supported by the different logic versions? is there any support for tdm without digidesign hardware?
what about the other formats?
well, i know that logic 5.0 will finally have individual outs for vsti´s and internal plugs, and i´m planning to get me a logic version when 5.0 is out, but i don´t know exactly if it should be the platinum, gold or silver version... what about the different plugs that come out of the box with logic?

thanks & greets
Mo

p.s.: btw, does anyone know matrox dualhead-cards and wacom pen tablets...? i mean, do they work together? or do i need two tablets for two displays...?

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Wed Aug 01, 2001 3:17 pm

Hi, on your question :

Does anyone know matrox dualhead-cards and wacom pen tablets...?

Yes, it work perfectly well, i have a G450 dualhead, both at 1280x1024 and Wacom A4 USB tablet. It pretty cool in mouse mode AND in screen mode.

With Logic on one side and Pulsar the other, this is a great tool.

Mo · Post by Mo » Wed Aug 01, 2001 3:26 pm

hey, thank you for these encouraging words

but it´s not working over here... i can only use the left screen with the pen. the right screen is only accessable via mouse.

g400dh, and wacom pen partner A6...

and not usb, but COM1.

did you have to make any setting, or was it working right out of the box?

_________________

da peppi connection! music and video feeds at <a href="http://www.peppisworld.de">http://www.peppisworld.de</a>

[ This Message was edited by: Mo on 2001-08-01 16:28 ]

Mo · Post by Mo » Wed Aug 01, 2001 3:40 pm

hey, it´s working... in mouse mode... but ääh... i want it work in pen mode! pen mode is much cooler! is there any possibility to get it work in pen mode?

Post by **garyb** » Thu Aug 02, 2001 7:23 pm

p.s.
got no problem with wanting better............
just a problem with greed and waste.......
you have a good balanced and tasty dinner,but reject it because the water is fizzy.
(david lindley only plays cheap 70's japanese guitars)
thanks for the pen tip!

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Thu Aug 02, 2001 9:21 pm

I Mo, it was working right out of the box. In fact, i have tested it when i was writing the previous post. I always work in mouse mode, i'm too lazy to mouve my hand all across that big A4

Maybe like I said, you should have same resolution in both screens.

Else, i don't know...

ohmelas · Post by **ohmelas** » Fri Aug 03, 2001 4:12 am

Hey All,

If you're really that upset complaining about it doesn't do anything. Creamware doesn't control everything in the world that is you, so get off your butt and write your own programs for the SHARC system. Not using their development tools but the development tools of the manufacture. Bring it to market and sell a better product. Complainers always take the easy route....

Below is a brief about Visual DSP the tool used to program and debug the SHARC family chips. If you don't like something change the world for the better. We have that freedom to do so.

Analog Devices' VisualDSP

Code Development | Host Interface & Debugging | Operating Systems & Libraries

VisualDSP is the new integrated project management and debugging environment for Analog Devices' digital signal processor (DSP) tools. The SHARC tools are the processor-specific develpment tools - assembler, C compiler, C runtime library, simulator, loader, and splitter - necessary for developing software for DSP products. These two products work together to provide you an integrated environment for developing applications for the ADSP-2106x family of DSPs.

VisualDSP introduces an easy-to-use project management environment, comprised of an Integrated Development Environment (IDE) and debugger. VisualDSP lets you manage projects from start to finish from within a single integrated interface. Because the project development and debug environments are integrated, you can move easily between editing, building, and debugging activities. The IDE and debugger are Windows-based interfaces and are supported on Windows® 95, Windows 98, and Windows NT.

BittWare offers the VisualDSP Target, which allows you to use the VisualDSP debugger with your BittWare DSP board.

Best Wishes to All,

Howard

Air_PoLLo · Post by **Air_PoLLo** » Sat Aug 04, 2001 12:49 am

So you're saying: "Shut up and build your own stuff, your ungreatful bastards!".

Well, go to hell. I spent 3000USD on a system I DEMAND to work!

PabloFasan · Post by **PabloFasan** » Sat Aug 04, 2001 5:50 pm

To OHMELAS:

Do you think that musicians have the MINIMUM interest in spending all this time in doing what is the programmers job?

Oh my dear, you are completely out of the reality!!!

What we need is high quality plugins at logic prices, developed by profesional programers.

We don't want to be free beta testers or amateur programmers, is not our job.