ADAT converter quality, A16, Behringer, etc

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:38 am

Hi all

I need to add 8 ins via the ADAT input, there are some choices, namely
Alesis AI3
Marian
Behringer ADA8000 Ultragain Pro (the new one)
A16
A16 Ultra (the new one)
Fostex VC8

Swissonic, Octopre etc are too expensive for me. Probably.

I used to have a VC8 but found it a bit blurry.

An A16 (original) used, is cheap.
But is the new Behringer better, because it is using new parts, chips etc? ie, why pay more?

I am using it maily for multiple synth outputs from a Roland JV5050. I have a Yamaha VL1 on the main analog in.
I have a small mixer for mic inputs, and mic quality is not important to me, as I have another system using a Mackie for vocals.

There is a discussion at:

http://duc.digidesign.com/showflat.php?Number=605990

Any tips welcome.

Thanks
Geoff

wayne · Post by **wayne** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:46 am

I can't speak comparatively, but my old A16 is a reliable, good sounding unit, been very useful for 5+ years

Hysteric · Post by **Hysteric** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:10 am

I recently got the Behringer unit and am very happy with it. I got good feedback on it here.

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:11 am

Hi
the Behringer has new AD chips etc that are supposed to be better than older ones; but it has to be Master I think, in sync, so is the clock etc as good as Creamware? Any techies out there who might know?
Thx

Post by **garyb** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:22 am

the ada8000 can be slaved. it works very well and is a great buy, especially with it's included mic pres. if you are on a budget and saving money is a priority, the ada8000 is the best(and only) choice imho.

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:31 am

Yes the ADA8000 does look good, the comments on that digi forum say it is good but not as good as the expensive ones for the mic pres which I don't need. (Boutique mic pres etc)

On line ins, for keyboards, am I right in thinking the AD converter is the issue?

In which case the ADA8000 is better as newest chips?

A local shop has it for 150 uk pounds. Which is pretty amazing.

But I can afford a better one, but it would cost more than the JV synth I bought used...

[ This Message was edited by: geoffd99 on 2006-09-08 02:32 ]

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:35 am

The AI3 is made by Alesis who maybe focus more on build quality than quantity of sales & it doesn't cost much more than the ADA8000. Personally, if I didn't need more mic pres & needed to make a choice between the AI3 & ADA8000, the AI3 would be the obvious choice.

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:42 am

The Marian ADCON looks good - as it is small and has 2 mic pres, and here it is about 250 - 280 UK (AI3 is 250 uk).

Anyone used Marian, compared to more common makes? Are the mic pres noticebly better than the IMP ones on the Behringer?

I have just found a thread on here where there is a similar question, no-one seems to have actually reviewed the Adcon.

The Behringer is looking favourite... as Octopre with Adat card is about 500 Uk pounds...

[ This Message was edited by: geoffd99 on 2006-09-08 03:02 ]

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:14 am

If you can stretch to an A16 ultra, it's definitely worth it. Incredible amount of I/O for the money. For me it's very similar to RME Multiface quality. It's not in Apogee/Prism territory but you can't expect that for the price.

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:26 am

Apart from the VC8 the ADA8000 is the poorest converter out of all the ones you're looking at. It might have half decent pres & the converters are actually made by alesis, but the pcbs & units are built on the cheap in the far east using cheap components like all other behringer gear, so having the same converters as the AI3 doesn't mean it'll sound as good or be as stable.. or have as good a psu for example. They skimp wherever they can which is why they can sell their gear cheaper than anyone else.

Darkrezin did I read somewhere here that you have an Apogee Rosetta?

dawman · Post by **dawman** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:41 am

In the recording studio, I would go for Rosettas, A16's, or Prisms if possible. But in live venues, the ADA8000 is my choice as it is barely noticable in terms of fidelity coming from FOH / Monitor, and at their current price you can have a spare/redundant unit in reserve. Their PSU is the only source of concern as it gets rather hot and smelly after 4 hours of power up.

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 5:23 am

No, although I used to have one (borrowed from a friend).

What I do have now though is an AD-1000 - it's an older Apogee A/D unit which includes a Millenia-built preamp section. It's basically the precursor to the current Mini-Me, except it doesn't have USB but DOES have wordclock

It sounds incredible even though it's only 20 bit

I also have some Apogee D/A's which I still haven't hooked up yet (need a nice mixer first and some 25-pin looms

nprime · Post by **nprime** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 7:12 am

I have both an A16 and a Behringer 8000.

The A16 is definitely a superior sounding unit, the sound quality is very very good. The Behringer is OK, but certainly not in the same class as the A16. I finds it lacks clarity and punch in comparison.

Is the Beringher a good buy for the money? Definitely.

You get what you pay for.

Rod

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 8:29 am

Hi
Is that an A16 or the new A16 Ultra?

Post by **garyb** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 9:22 am

if you have the money, get the a16 ultra.

sonolive · Post by **sonolive** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 11:09 am

On 2006-09-08 10:22, garyb wrote:
if you have the money, get the a16 ultra.

FOR SURE
i personnaly have got three , no regrets, studio or live

cheers,
olive

[ This Message was edited by: sonolive on 2006-09-08 12:10 ]

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 11:52 am

Hi all
Well *** VERY SCARY *** I just bought a Behringer ADA8000 cos it was very cheap...

I will report back on how it sounds, I am using a JV5050 - I will plug it in on

SPDIF;

via Pulsar analog input; and

via the ADA8000 AD converter.

If I get the time I will post some files.

My Plan is to use SPDIF to pass main stereo out, and then use ADA8000 for extras like bass, drums etc, which will then go into CW for Vinco etc.

This assumes SPDIF and ADAT can be used at same time; I used a TC Electronics delay unit recently but it caused the PC to freeze on using SPDIF... so Hugh Nose...

This should be Sunday.

BTW if the PSU is bad, would improving the power supply help any audio deterioration?

Toodle pip
G

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 2:13 am

not necessarily, your options vary a lot in this domain - from a simple transformer to a fully equipped switching PSU.

the most common trad design is a transformer with a rectifier diode array. In a good design the latter are so-called 'fast recovery types', that emit significantly less noise.
This doesn't affect the 'sound' itself but may be reflected in the SNR.

The transformers themselves may hum or break earlier, they could be non-replacable (much cheaper) etc.

The sound difference of the cheaper units is most likely due to the use of analog components.
I admit my eyes almost popped recently as I read the prices of quality capacitors.
Not the big ones in PSUs, but those small items coupling analog stages...

You can 'tune' a lot of gear by 'simply' replacing those items, though simply isn't that simple because the size of the better versions (Styroflex) doesn't fit the space where the cheapo's usually sit...

cheers, Tom

geoffd99 · Post by **geoffd99** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 6:28 am

Behringer ADA8000.
Set up in 1 minute plug and play.
Now I am running a Korg M electribe thing through it - which I happended to be playing with direct input yesterday - and it sounds better. Which is pretty weird.
The bass is making the speakers flap (hhb C5s) so not sure about lack of bottom. This is on line ins; as I remarked, I won't be using the mics pres very much.

So seems like a good deal ... so far. No more tests as have to dash. I iwll try the mic pres but I have used IMP before, they are very clear and non-intrusive.

I am offline for a few days but will post some demo files in a week or so (I always seem to buy gear before break... must be something to do with getting funds in lumps!).

Anyway, seems all ok to me. And only 150 uk pounds new!

Geoff