I need info about STS

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Sun Feb 13, 2005 2:39 pm

I use a laptop, and want a low latency sampler. I have bee reading some topics here. It seems that the samples a loaded on the system RAM, but I have read also, that "can be used without ASIO", so, I understand that come directly from the RAM through the pci bus.
Well, what sampler playing latency?, 3ms, 5ms 10ms? Give me a number,
Depend this latency the same way that the sofware sampler based? (cpu use, programs loaded)
Also, anyone knows if would be as fast using a Magma chasis? (pci to pcmcia)
What formats can STS load? akai? giga?

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:07 pm

well, you have a pretty expensive solution in mind with Magma etc.
With all respect (and my best wishes) for CWA, but I really would stay away from the STS idea.
Simply said: your investment will not be as rewarding as you expect it. Unfortunately.

Time has moved on, but the STS is more or less a classic AKAI - a good one, but you certainly expect something more today from that kind of instrument.

cheers, Tom

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:06 am

It´s just an idea, anyway I want to be sure, about all can do and not can do, that´s why ask here and need all info posible.
Well, I think a Clasicc Akai, is not a bad thing for playing, I know it has editing limits, but for mixing I could use an sofware sampler, the thing is to can play with hardware latency, and I think about Scope+Magma because of space, it would be portable.
Can you be more splicit?

symbiote · Post by **symbiote** » Tue Feb 15, 2005 10:22 am

You'd probably be better off with an AKAI or EMU sampler to lug around and play live. The latency of the STS sampler should be fairly low, if nothing goes thru ASIO. Probably a few miliseconds at most. The only problem, like astroman said/implied, is that the STS samplers are a bit dodgy, there should be a few thread about it here and there if you want more details. My personal experience with STS3000 have been a bit unpleasant, I spent countless hours trying to get the sound levels + envelope settings + filters settings right, and that's just to manage to play a sample right, at the right volume without any envelope processing. I tend to use it to load a few drumkits and sometimes AKAI, but I don't do anyhing really sophisticated with it, I do all the processing (filtering etc) outside the sampler. They also have a phasing problem on the stereo output (not sure if it's only the STS5000 or all of them, I don't use the stereo outputs much on the STS3000 I have.)

I mean, it would probably work, but you'd be much better off (I think) with a low-latency firewire/cardbus audio interface (echo indigo, motu etc) and a software sampler than with a complicated magma+pulsar setup, which would be more useful if you planned to run some synths and fx at the same time.

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:32 pm

Well, I personally love the STS samplers. The 5000's pitchshifting is a bit unstable, but otherwise I think they're great. The only issue is that its I-Out system is terrible, which means if you really want to put different effects on different sample programs, then you need to load multiple instances of the device. That isn't TOO difficult however, if you keep the voice count tuned to each program's needs.

I like the built-in audio editor which allows me to set the start and loop times directly by seeing the waveform. Nobody else seems to have that.

Shayne

okantah · Post by **okantah** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 1:52 pm

The sts samplers are great,ONLY when one has no patience enough to study the manuals to work with it!expecially the sts5000.to my opinion i would not call halion a sampler.
And the individual outputs,no problems,14 outs + 2 stereo outs.ONE must lean to use the sts samplers.sts 5000 is wonderfull sampler.
cheers

cream · Post by **cream** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 1:59 pm

Don't you have phase issues with sts-5000?
I would go for the sts-4000. It's cheaper and it works like it should.

okantah · Post by **okantah** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 3:20 pm

Hi cream until now not,the sts 5000 manual is big one,and one need the time to study that,
believe me it's very pro sampler,one only need the time enough to study all it's functions,if you really want the sts samplers,go for it,
cheers

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:44 pm

Can any of you measure the real latency for me?

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:23 am

seriously, if they are used without asio, latency is in the SUB millisecond range....

You will not even find hardware samplers with such a low latency!

With asio, you can expect from 3-7 ms steady latency.

I have all the sts samplers, and they are great. But they use so much DSP they i use them mainly to CREATE program that i export and use with another vsti sampler after.

They are still great samplers nonetheless

okantah · Post by **okantah** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 11:36 am

lagoausente
With the creamware stuff i don't think about latency.
the only point about the sts's is you need patient to read the manual.dont waiste time now.
cheers

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 12:11 pm

DSP power!? The STS samplers use far less DSP power than any other Scope synth. What are you talking about??

okantah · Post by **okantah** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:06 pm

Greetings Shayne White.
I mean CW stuff in general i don't think about latency.
he asked of latency of sts's.
cheers

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:43 pm

Sorry, I should have used a quote...I was replying to Marcuspocus. I'm sorry!

okantah · Post by **okantah** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:46 pm

Shayne White.
no problem
cheers

marcuspocus · Post by **marcuspocus** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 4:57 pm

I mean, in a basic really low end gigastudio 32, which cost about 60$, or about any other native samplers, i can get those 32 voices of polyphony, i can't on a luna2 at 500€ + a STS3000.

But again, they are still usefull samplers (sts series), 'cause they are real sampler, which can sample thing, like in record audio.

Even if it's my best sampler here, i can't use it really because i have 7dsps, not 15. More, i wouldn't waste those 15dsps on sampling you see?

I would use a native samplers, going to my scope rig thru any mega effects, i would also put those dsp to work on flexor patchs, which no native app can come close.

That's what i'm saying...

okantah · Post by **okantah** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:05 pm

marcuspocus.
your point is different here! consider that 7dsp's is just basic,yet there's way out! of reaching many voices.
I have 19dsp's and im crying for 45 dsp's.hope you get my point here.
cheers

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:12 am

Well, my soundcard buffer is setted to 2ms, but this is no real. I take my 8pad Roland SPd11,and a mic, I measure this:
Take the mic and put it 2cm from the pad, to record the sound when I hit the pad.
Take the midi output to the pc, through Halion and take the souncard output (2 ms buffer).
I record the mic on L and the Halion output on R, and measure 10 ms of real latency, that means, extra latency of D/A, midi in, window XP processing etc.
I would like someone of you could make this simple test for me,on STS , it´s just 10 minutes.