midi clock/sync

[Liquid EDGE]

I'm posting here as don't think it's a problem. Just me not setting it up properly?

But I was using arpeg2 and inside scope everything is tight.
But playing from cubase is a little sloppy. And when I set up cubase to output midi clock and set arpeg2 to listen to external midi clock it's not a tight sync at all.
Cubase is set to internal sync.
Any recommendations on how to set up a tight midi clock/sync?

[next to nothing]

Before continuing reading please be aware that this method is NOT a rock stable solution

While going over the same thoughts as you, i did some experimenting. Main issue was to get a tighter sync signal to control Scope and sequencer app. In a ideal world i would have a good quality external midi clock to do this, however i do not have that. So i started looking for a standalone software midi clock, which i found at http://www.robotsforrobots.net/viewtopic.php?id=8243 .

I have had this up and running in both reaper and ableton live so i guess its fine with cubase as well. Here's a screenshot of an example project setup:

sync1.jpg (48.76 KiB) Viewed 3303 times

Sequencer MIDI aource 2 is where the PTC sends its clock signal. This signal is routed to both Arpeg01 (Mclk) and the sequencers midi input (MIDI dest 1).

Reaper is then told to pickup its clock from MIDI dest 1, and let PTC control it:

sync2.jpg (55.52 KiB) Viewed 3303 times

Now, pressing space with the PTC window active fires it all up, with a "stabelish" clock.

Remarks:

1.) The tempo control in PTC is flimsy at best. Setting it to 120bpm gives me a real tempo of around 131bpm as far as i can see on Arpeg01

2.) PTC might work better on optimized PCs.

3.) I see the new Mattomat device has a Master-setting, i have no idea how stable that is in comparison, maybe someone can elaborate?

Its good fun to experiment though, and the timing is far more satisfying than what the sequencer clock signals i have been trying with scope earlier

[Liquid EDGE]

Hey thanks for that, i'll try it out.

I did buy mattomat on monday and got the key for it yesterday and going to the studio to install today, so i'll try that as well.
I'll report back and let you know what both solutions are like.
I was looking for a device box called midi clock in scope, hoping that creamware/sonic core had made one.

I make a lot of dnb which is at around 175 bpm so any timing issues jump out and are obvious.

Cheers mate.

[next to nothing]

Sounds good

Just be aware of the DAWs configuration options as well

In example, i just upped PTC tempo to 185bpm (Scope reports approx 205), which made reaper jump and skip until i changed some (obvious) configuration:

sync3.jpg (55.49 KiB) Viewed 3292 times

[Liquid EDGE]

Cool, Thanks again.

[jksuperstar]

I would avoid MIDI clock generated by the host computer if possible.

Mattomat will probably give you a very good clock. I say this because you can also use some of the MIDI clock gen modules in Modular 2/3 to make a solid clock, and when I connect that to other hardware that locks to clocks, it is rock solid, and even Ableton Live when locked will drift by hundredths of a beat (102.00 +/- 0.04 for example!). To me, this is about as good as it gets, mostly due to MIDI limitations.

I can usually tell how good a clock is by connecting a beat-sync'd delay, with fairly short delay time, but more feedback. You'll hear the overlap of delays get out of sync quickly.

[Liquid EDGE]

I was thinking it's because of the host computer and the midi clock from cubase being software, thus why it was slopping about.
Really shows how little i know about the modular. Might make a patch just for a midi clock device.

Nice one people.

[next to nothing]

I've dived onto the modular myself Thanks for the hint!

[jksuperstar]

I was thinking it's because of the host computer and the midi clock from cubase being software, thus why it was slopping about.

That's exactly the problem I have, with ANY daw. One other option, if you have Modular IV, there is a module that syncs with a corresponding VST (also included with Mod IV), to more tightly sync a clock in SCOPE to the host daw, but I still have better luck syncing the host to a hardware clock.

[Liquid EDGE]

I was thinking it's because of the host computer and the midi clock from cubase being software, thus why it was slopping about.

That's exactly the problem I have, with ANY daw. One other option, if you have Modular IV, there is a module that syncs with a corresponding VST (also included with Mod IV), to more tightly sync a clock in SCOPE to the host daw, but I still have better luck syncing the host to a hardware clock.

Hey? I have modular 4, again just played with the patches, (pre built synths).
So there should be a midi clock module and a vst module?
How do you open the vst in cubase? Just like it was a vst instrument?
and then open the module in scope?
Then cubase when sending midi clock info will be tighter?
Don't fully get how it would be set up?

Thanks though.
I'll see how the otions go, if it's not tight enough mabe a hardware midi clock is the way to go.

[jksuperstar]

In the install of SCOPE, look in:
(SCOPE)/Additionals/Modular4/VST Plugin/

Grab the file there, and copy into your typical VST plugin directory. In your DAW, drop that VST into a track. Then in SCOPE, open a Modular4 device, and add the "VSTMidiClock" module. There's a sync button on it, and when it syncs with the VST module, the Link light should glow. Of course, the downside, is it only puts out Freq and Gate (start/stop indicated through this). There is no "MIDI Clock" output from this module, which is unfortunate. But if you build effects inside Modular, it's helpful. I haven't tried this with Swing in my daw, I'll put it on my list of things to explore.

The other module to use that I mentioned, which makes a really nice clock, is the MidiClock module. That does put out an actual MIDI clock. And if you send it out of the Modular Shell via the MIDI port, you can then send it to a Sequencer Destination, and sync your daw to that. That's my preferred method. In fact, I then use a module from G.O.S.T. found here (MidiBeatAdd):
http://forums.planetz.com/viewtopic.php ... 73#p275273

Use a MIDI Merge on that device with a modular shell output (using MIDIClock), and you have clock with start/stop/Cont/Reset commands too!! It's the most stable clock I've got in my studio to sync the computer with (since the scope driver is such low latency, it beats other hardware clocks like my Yamaha QY-70 which get in via hardware MIDI, through a MIDI interface, etc).

[Liquid EDGE]

In the install of SCOPE, look in:
(SCOPE)/Additionals/Modular4/VST Plugin/

I did wonder what on earth that was for. As i never use vstim/xtc mode i never install any path that says vst in it.

In the install of SCOPE, look in:
Use a MIDI Merge on that device with a modular shell output (using MIDIClock), and you have clock with start/stop/Cont/Reset commands too!! It's the most stable clock I've got in my studio to sync the computer with (since the scope driver is such low latency, it beats other hardware clocks like my Yamaha QY-70 which get in via hardware MIDI, through a MIDI interface, etc).

So these two are needed really as you need to be able to start stop etc as the start stop in cubase wont work if cubase is set to listen to an external clock?

[jksuperstar]

I'm not sure about Cubase, but that is how Ableton Live is. (when external sync is enabled, Live disables it's own start/stop controls, and those must come from an external source).

[dawman]

Also use Assafs' Clock2Click device for recording in Mattotmat.
I just started today and am using 20/8 to have extra bars, so it's a lifesaver having a clocked click sound, using whatever wav. file for the Clicks' audio.
Mattomat is an incredible tool.
I really like assigning a low note to tripper part 1-4 in Mattomat and the timing is great as the part finishes then moves onto the next part.
Reminds me of the old Roland Phrase Sequencing on their excellent MV-30 which I still have.
The sounds are 16bit lameness, but the hardware sequencer is as tight as a knats ass.

[next to nothing]

Had an issue maybe someone can help me with. Im on win7 64bit.

I shut down Scope, placing the Mbeatadd to devices/tools folder, downloaded the 64bit sysfile and added it to the app/sys folder. First time launching scope gave a driver signing error, i tried doing it all again but now it complains about a missing DSP file.

Anyone had this issue?

[Liquid EDGE]

Cubase does not slave to midi clock. It will only slave to mtc.
Looks like my only option is to get a hardware master sync unit to send mtc to cubase and midi clock to scope?
Unless scope is able to send mtc?

[Liquid EDGE]

Right.
Everything is tight tight tight now.
I was being an idiot.
Basically use a midi port exclusively for transmitting the midi clock from cubase and do not have "midi clock follows project position" checked in the sync settings of cubase.

Hoorah.

Thanks for the ideas anyhows peeps.

[widy]

from my point of view as i worked with the normal mode a alwayse used up to 8 midi sequencer source and destinations instead of one and using differend midi channels for synths

the only different was that instead of changing a midi channel i selected a midi destination inside the daw
i alwayse get some relay nice timings

try by itself ....
build up 8 kick me devices and and rout it back with different asio channels and record all asio channels at the same time ..... try this with on midi device and different midi channels and try this with with different midi devices ....

because midi is a serial protocol and if u use just one channel .... each track will influence other tracks ...
lg widy