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Folks-

Let me just say thanks. I'm spreading the love because you guys are cool and you're firing me up to get my setup going...I'm a new user, but I've got the passion inside like so many of us do. I'd like to describe my setup ideas and get some feedback for how you guys do your recording, so I can get on with the music.

I don't have much right now: Pulsar II and Sonar. I'll use Pulsar II on the front-end for mixing/routing. I'll record my audio dry and pass it through a 24 bit wave dest to Sonar (or maybe 24 bit asio2 to Cubase SX/or maybe straight to VDAT - still narrowing that down). I'll edit my audio in Sonar/Cubase, then source the tracks back into Pulsar, through a mixer (insert effects), then route the mix outs to VDAT. (I think it's important that if you're using Pulsar's DSP effects, that you also record in Pulsar. I think you'll get the cleanest best-sounding DSP effects this way - as opposed to doing this within Sonar/Cubase). Once I've mixed in effects and I have a stereo wave file, I'll play this back through optiMaster for post-production shaping into VDAT. Then, I'll open that 24-bit wave file in Sonar/Cubase for final dithering to 16 bits in preparation for CD burning. (I'm speaking strictly in audio terms...haven't even gotten into the MIDI world yet, but all in good time.) What do you guys think? Is this a decent hobbyist setup? What do you do? Thanks for your time and feedback. I'm getting smarter!

I dunno, I think you are trying to "straddle two boats" by using both cubase/sonar and VDAT.
The good thing about VDAT is that it is plug and record so to speak.

If you are goin to edit the audio in cubase anyway wouldn't it be easier just to record in cubase? I mean as long as you keep your files 24bit then I doubt you'll lose much sonically, and its one less factor in the equation.

Maybe just keep the VDAT for when you want to record straight away, ie load project and record.

I know at least one guy who just simply uses his computer and very little else and gets by nicely finacially so I think you have all you need in the pulsar card, key to it is reliability and useability cus at the end of the day these are just my opinions.

You've gotta find what works best for you.

hi alabama,

I'd like to emphasize what remixme said:
keep it as simple as possible
If you don't need midi, maybe you can leave out the sequencers completely and just get along with VDAT.
Dunno how many instances of VDAT are possible (my SFP disk is still laying around unused), but with the patch applied you should be able to have 16 tracks (just an example for simplicity).
So record the pure signal on the first 8 tracks, then playback and apply effects or whatever and record to the remaining 8 tracks.
Should be a simple routing to setup.
One hint to the signal quality: 24 bits for softsynths and specially vocals and acoustic instruments are fine (if you got good pres and converters), but there's a lot of great outboard equipment which is far from that resolution. The Yamaha DX7, many Rolands and those famous 12 bit drumboxes just to name a few. In many cases the 'roughness' of those sounds adds that special extra to a mix.
Ok, I admit that I'm a bit of a lofi fan who finds many of todays 'chart' mixes rather annoying. Too clean and too perfect - but of course that's subjective.

cheers, Tom

ps remixme: guitar's day coming closer

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2002-06-15 15:39 ]</font>

The KISS principle; Keep It Simple, Stupid!

Astroman; Yep certainly is, two weeks. Still haven't figured out how to ship the thing though, we'll sort something!

Welcome Alabama!

Well, let me disagree with you when you say: “I don’t have much right now, Pulsar II and Sonar”. In fact, you already have a complete studio. I have a Pulsar I and Cubase VST, and still happy and discovering new sounds all the time! So please, be happy, you own a superb studio.

I would prefer Cubase SX if I was at your place, the sound engine it is said to be extremely good, one of the best of the market. I think your procedure is good, as many others. It heavily depends on what you want to do and how many instruments are you handling at the same time, or tracks.

I do all my recordings coming through Pulsar into Cubase at 16b resolution, then I would eventually come back to Pulsar and would pass it with the effects I want to use, or directly into the Wave Editor finishing what I want with native plug-ins.

The interesting thing with Pulsar is that you can do absolutely any kind of rutting, so there are new ways coming to your eyes all the time. You can be very creative. I found that rutting was a difficult thing to learn at the beginning, then, when I got a bit accustomed to it, I started to route everything to everywhere discovering wild ways of working. Your question is certainly extremely interesting. It would be good to create a complete threat exclusively about it.

Something is true: you need more DSPs if you want to build up big projects, like I want to. This is my only frustration when I talk about Pulsar, so, lack of power cos I just have 4 sharks. Believe me, with two more sharks like you have, I would be quite comfortable already.

There is a Chinese maxim which says: “You are not rich for having much, but for valuing what you have”. Again, trust me, you are going to be SURPRISED at what you can do with Pulsar and any sequencer! Enjoy!!!

All, comments appreciated! Keep'em coming! I'm doing some comparisons between Sonar & Cubase right now. (actually, I'm using the demo version of VST/32 - cool that Steinberg lets you take a trial run - wish more companies were this way!) I don't know what kind of dithering Sonar uses from 24 to 16, but it does sound decent. I know Cubase is one of the company's setting the standard, and Cakewalk is coming along trying to get into the game. One thing I've noticed: when I'm recording in Sonar my system is fairly quiet, but when recording in Cubase, my harddrive is grinding away! Could this be one of the differences between the wave/asio drivers, and how they write to disk? I'm using the asio2-flt source/dest. This is running at 32 bits, so maybe this is why my HDD sounds like a coffee grinder. Can anybody agree with me and offer a suggestion that might keep my HDD from working so hard? Or is such the price you pay for higher bits (as opposed to the 24 bit wave dest)? My HDD is new btw: 7200rpm, ata-100, 75GB. That grinding is feeding back into my Rode NT1! Keeping your computer quiet is another story, huh?!?

Another thought...I haven't purchased VDAT yet, but I'm considering it. I wonder if using VDAT will crunch on my HDD too? Can any VDAT user yea or nea this? Thanks Pulsar bro's & sis's. coffee anyone?

Hey, it's Saturday, I'm having fun, and I'm talking to myself...

The HDD grinding thing has to be from the buffering setup...ie, how many times the buffer dumps to disk, hence causing all the seeking and accessing. Maybe Sonar's default settings are larger than Cubase's. When recording, there is some HDD activity, but it's much less than Cubase's. I'll try adjusting that in Cubase in the audio settings. ok, I'll quieten down and let others comment.

I might jump in and advise a bit. Do you need VDAT? you already have a recording app, sonar. what do you need VDAT for? Is there a piece of soft/hardware that you don't have that you want? I might consider getting that before you double up on apps. Optimaster would be a fine choice . . .

On 2002-06-15 17:48, alabama wrote:
Another thought...I haven't purchased VDAT yet, but I'm considering it. I wonder if using VDAT will crunch on my HDD too? Can any VDAT user yea or nea this? Thanks Pulsar bro's & sis's. coffee anyone?

Yes, VDAT will crunch on your harddisk.

Badly...

It almost need it's own harddisk if you need more than 16 tracks playback or record more than 8 at a times. And i agree with algorythm, if it is not really needed, there are alot of better thing to buy first.

Well, it all depends on what kinda work you do. VDAT is great when you make alot of live takes. Recording multiple tracks in 24bits or 32bits directly from SFP for example, without the need for a sequencer.

It's in fact just another way to remove a layer of 'possible' problem when doing live takes.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: marcuspocus on 2002-06-16 22:29 ]</font>

On 2002-06-15 16:37, Nestor wrote:
The interesting thing with Pulsar is that you can do absolutely any kind of rutting, so there are new ways coming to your eyes all the time. You can be very creative. I found that rutting was a difficult thing to learn at the beginning

Nestor, you're at it again

Got another setup question:

Is there such thing as an audio "y-adapter". I mean, I'd like to run my Pulsar analog outs to both studio speakers and headphones at the same time (and just have one of them active at the time), without having to disconnect/reconnect every time I want to switch outputs.

Ie, do you guys know of a device that will take an audio input and split it to one of two outputs with the flip of a switch?

Thanks for the thoughts.

probably easiest solution would be little mixer...

erm, hardware one i mean, like Behringer or something

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Michu on 2002-07-18 22:52 ]</font>

i would just use cubase or logic to do all your recording to(audio AND midi).i'd get a program like samplitude and use it as a two track mastering deck(it burns red book cd's)

record all you want to the sequencer as though it were a hardware multitrack recorder.mix down from this multitrack thru the sequencer mixer and plugs and out to the sfp environment into whatever plugs and mixers were appropriate (optimaster,phaser,delays, reverbs and maybe the 2448 mixer,whatever)into your two track.

burn the cd.

this is typically how things are done in the real world and this method works well in the virtual world as well.this makes the whole operation straight forward and easy and has the proper work flow imho.still, what works best for you is cool.simple is more likely to not get in your way......

the cool thing is that only cw will let you work like this,virtually.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2002-07-19 03:40 ]</font>

I'm sure there is a little flip-switch device thingy. I remember you used to be able to get one for the TV so you could flick to the megadrive !

It would be a pretty simple device, really.

Michu,

I agree, but a simple mixer usually takes multiple inputs and gives you 1 stereo out. I would need 2 stereo ins, and 2 stereo outs. Mixers do this, but it's just a matter of finding the right one that's simple and is basically just used for routing. (all processing done in CW!)

garyb,

Thanks for your setup feedback! I'm operating with Pulsar II and Cubase SX. (thinking about buying a Yamaha S80 keyboard before long - any opinion?) The mastering part is what I need to get down. I'm considering optiMaster, but since we already have compressors/limiters/eq in CW, what does optiMaster provide but just a wizard and all these in the same pkg? I'll check into Samplitude as a mastering program. Could Cubase SX serve in this capacity? This is what I'm doing right now.

I'm also in the midst of setting up my system with a second HDD for audio only. I did notice a couple of stray pops in my mixdown when I was using the OS HDD for audio too. Yowee! It's important to have that separate HDD!

mr swim,
Now we just gotta find it!