Dear PZ brothers (and sisters) - please help me! It's been some time since I've had the opportunity to write my own songs, as most of my time is spent mixing other people's music.
Pulsar has inspired me to get back into the songwriting game again, but much to my horror I've discovered I just can't come up with anything interesting! I used to write catchy pop tunes by the bucketload, but now I find myself making 4-bar loops that go nowhere. Did my creative juices dry up due to several years of neglect? Or is this a common crisis for people who are close to turning 30?
I'd love to know what you clever composers do for inspiration... Please tell me your secrets!
Cheers,
Retro
Creative Juices?
(I just turned 31... 
)
I think it's like a biorhythm, only in longer periods.
What I try to do and what sometimes helps are the following things:
- DON'T TAKE IT TOO SERIOUS
(like "I MUST do a GOOD song now, I HAVE to start and HAVE to find a background/melody etc. - that leads exactly to the 4-bar-loop-thing (several of them sounding nearly the same...).
Try to do a complete other kind of song just for training your skills - without the expectation it has to get a good one.
Give yourself some "crazy" rules, for example: kick-drum and snare is not allowed in the song, leading voice has to be a ukulele only minor-chords allowed and so on.
Just try that, and the possibility is great that you get very soon inspiration back, additionaly in a new creative direction.
And don't stop and think this is shit unless you did at least 1 minute of song.
Next step could be to improve that training-song within those rules.
- IF POSSIBLE, TAKE A BREAK
Get the whole music-thing out of your head and make something completely other, like going for a swim, for a long walk in nature, make a short-trip to another city you haven't been before. Forget to think about music and composing for that time. You know the 40 days in the desert (bible)...
Don't be afraid of losing something from your skills, cause you can't lose what has always been inside you. There may be just some dust above it...
By NOT thinking about it is in my opinion the best way to "dig in the dirt".
- DON'T TRY TO MAKE GREATER EFFORTS TO REACH GOAL
Working more and more on a "problem" makes finally the problem bigger and bigger.
You only get more inspirated when you like very much to do the work. When not, inspiration goes down with every additional note you set on paper or in cubase/logic
Hope that helps.
)I think it's like a biorhythm, only in longer periods.
What I try to do and what sometimes helps are the following things:
- DON'T TAKE IT TOO SERIOUS
(like "I MUST do a GOOD song now, I HAVE to start and HAVE to find a background/melody etc. - that leads exactly to the 4-bar-loop-thing (several of them sounding nearly the same...).
Try to do a complete other kind of song just for training your skills - without the expectation it has to get a good one.
Give yourself some "crazy" rules, for example: kick-drum and snare is not allowed in the song, leading voice has to be a ukulele
only minor-chords allowed and so on.Just try that, and the possibility is great that you get very soon inspiration back, additionaly in a new creative direction.
And don't stop and think this is shit unless you did at least 1 minute of song.
Next step could be to improve that training-song within those rules.
- IF POSSIBLE, TAKE A BREAK
Get the whole music-thing out of your head and make something completely other, like going for a swim, for a long walk in nature, make a short-trip to another city you haven't been before. Forget to think about music and composing for that time. You know the 40 days in the desert (bible)...
Don't be afraid of losing something from your skills, cause you can't lose what has always been inside you. There may be just some dust above it...
By NOT thinking about it is in my opinion the best way to "dig in the dirt".
- DON'T TRY TO MAKE GREATER EFFORTS TO REACH GOAL
Working more and more on a "problem" makes finally the problem bigger and bigger.
You only get more inspirated when you like very much to do the work. When not, inspiration goes down with every additional note you set on paper or in cubase/logic
Hope that helps.
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paulrmartin
- Posts: 2445
- Joined: Sun May 20, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Montreal, Canada
I agree with Zounds. Put that 4-bar loop through a grinder(moonizer, perhaps). Just the sound of it shifting around should arouse some kind of emotional reaction in you. 
Uh.. you could read Brian Eno's Oblique Strategies, but it's very esoteric.
_________________
Paul R. Martin
I think I may get the hang of this after all!
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: paulrmartin on 2002-05-10 06:36 ]</font>
Uh.. you could read Brian Eno's Oblique Strategies, but it's very esoteric.
_________________
Paul R. Martin
I think I may get the hang of this after all!
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: paulrmartin on 2002-05-10 06:36 ]</font>
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kensuguro
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I'm usually an on and off type of guy.. I write 2 months straight, and then spend a month doing something totally different.. camping, driving, catching up with friends, family. I try to keep anything musical off my mind.. saying "save it for later, save it for later" I jot down each of the ideas as clearly as I can. And then maybe a month later I'll actually do it.
So, it's kind of strange. When I look for inspiration, I go further away from music. Inspiration from other music is too technical to be an innovative one.. It's more like I have to learn something as a person, and grow a bit.
That said tho, I really do wish you good luck in searching for you mojo.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: kensuguro on 2002-05-10 07:38 ]</font>
So, it's kind of strange. When I look for inspiration, I go further away from music. Inspiration from other music is too technical to be an innovative one.. It's more like I have to learn something as a person, and grow a bit.
That said tho, I really do wish you good luck in searching for you mojo.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: kensuguro on 2002-05-10 07:38 ]</font>
Additionally, sometimes writing a full song is a bit of a burden especially if you haven't written something for so long.
In one of the forums I'm in we have 45 second song competitions and that is a great and fun way to help the creative juices flow. It is much easier to fill a 30-45 second silence than a 4 minute one.
I'm such a dickhead when I compose. Sometimes half-way through the song I ditch the majority of the material and start a new song around a gem of a loop I created in the middle of it. And sometimes that's the way of it. You perservere with something that sounds like complete crap only to produce something in the middle that is worth building a song around. Then it suddenly is way too good for the washy shit around it - so you find it a new home in a new song.
In one of the forums I'm in we have 45 second song competitions and that is a great and fun way to help the creative juices flow. It is much easier to fill a 30-45 second silence than a 4 minute one.
I'm such a dickhead when I compose. Sometimes half-way through the song I ditch the majority of the material and start a new song around a gem of a loop I created in the middle of it. And sometimes that's the way of it. You perservere with something that sounds like complete crap only to produce something in the middle that is worth building a song around. Then it suddenly is way too good for the washy shit around it - so you find it a new home in a new song.
Caleb
Happiness is the hidden behind the obvious.
Happiness is the hidden behind the obvious.
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kensuguro
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great phylosophy caleb. I also love making 30 second jingles, cuz I can test out so many different ideas with it, without the responsibility of actually finishing it.
Another cool way to get great juices flowing is to do a remix of some of your old material, or just simply something that you're laugh at. Say, like a 2 op FM. Sounds like a TV game, but then it gets you thinking.. "how would it sound if I beefed it up?"
Another cool way to get great juices flowing is to do a remix of some of your old material, or just simply something that you're laugh at. Say, like a 2 op FM. Sounds like a TV game, but then it gets you thinking.. "how would it sound if I beefed it up?"
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paulrmartin
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I don't think Retro's looking to do another remix though...
I once found myself listening to the rhythm of the water in the drain pipes in our basement...Damn it, I really should have sampled that sound...
_________________
Paul R. Martin
I think I may get the hang of this after all!
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: paulrmartin on 2002-05-10 07:45 ]</font>
I once found myself listening to the rhythm of the water in the drain pipes in our basement...Damn it, I really should have sampled that sound...
_________________
Paul R. Martin
I think I may get the hang of this after all!
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: paulrmartin on 2002-05-10 07:45 ]</font>
Ooooh that's a good one Paul. Sometimes I try to hear rhythms and textures of sound in everyday life. Leaves rustling as a pad sound with peoples' footsteps and car horns. I try to put everything around me in a song and then tends to be inspirational - well occasionally anyway.
I also tend to hear instruments in my head as I'm walking and can sometimes compose something that I really like on my way home from work. Unfortunately on most occasions I've actually forgotten it by the time I get home. DOH!
I also tend to hear instruments in my head as I'm walking and can sometimes compose something that I really like on my way home from work. Unfortunately on most occasions I've actually forgotten it by the time I get home. DOH!
Caleb
Happiness is the hidden behind the obvious.
Happiness is the hidden behind the obvious.
Good hint, Ken! Most of the time I only do computer and music, and it get's a little annoying. Days are all the same, time stands still. When I'm at work, or w friends or family, my head's focussed on music. After long time on the comp, there's no more other signals in my brain, only music. When I talk to people, I tend to talk music. I have not seen anything else than music either, so my inspiration is all about... music. Very boring and annoying for the people around me. And for myself. I definately gonna try your two months on, one month off trick.On 2002-05-10 07:37, kensuguro wrote:
I'm usually an on and off type of guy.. I write 2 months straight, and then spend a month doing something totally different...
Also, when I'm on to something good, I used to let sleep for later, stay awake very long hours, like sleep 4-5hrs a week for months. That definitely kills your brain and freshness for a while. Now I convinced myself, that when I come back to the pc, everything will still be there, it doesn't disappear when I go to bed. There's 24hrs a day, and 8 of them are for sleep.
A tip to make good music: Have good oversight. Try to prepare, get everything in (flexible) templates and stuff ready so you don't have to start looking for new mixer or routing scheme. The CC# presets are a major improvement, and will savelots of creative time. I never did songs as good as the ones I did in Fruityloops, cos it was so fonking simple and everything I needed was there. Now the setup's become very complex, and it's hard to concentrate or relax on one main thing.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: at0mic on 2002-05-10 07:58 ]</font>
ooooh FruityLoops. I liked that software but I did not feel it to be very "creation-inducing" for me anyway.
That was THE program in which I just fiddled and ended up with a pile of 8 bar pieces of crap that I could never be bothered taking anywhere.
Muzys on the other hand....(launches into paragraphs of over-exaggerated praise).
Thought I'd give you the Readers Digest version - oooops wait a minute.
YOU COULD HAVE ALREADY WON $1,000,000
There - Readers Digest version.
But your advice is sound Atomboy. I'm tired, I've listened to my project about 30 times in a row and still don't know what to do next. Bed time.
That was THE program in which I just fiddled and ended up with a pile of 8 bar pieces of crap that I could never be bothered taking anywhere.
Muzys on the other hand....(launches into paragraphs of over-exaggerated praise).
Thought I'd give you the Readers Digest version - oooops wait a minute.
YOU COULD HAVE ALREADY WON $1,000,000
There - Readers Digest version.
But your advice is sound Atomboy. I'm tired, I've listened to my project about 30 times in a row and still don't know what to do next. Bed time.
Caleb
Happiness is the hidden behind the obvious.
Happiness is the hidden behind the obvious.
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algorhythm
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i don't like fruityloops either 
i am still thinking of making a track of office sounds; you ever listen to the rhythm of a printer? . . .
regarding inspiration: it is usually there, you just need to call it forth. Uberzone said in an interview for Remix magazine that his little microrecorder was his favorite piece of gear. he just keeps it in his pocket, whips it out wherever, and talks ideas into, beatboxes, whatever. this is a great way to save those little thoughts we have! of course, people look at you funny, but well. . . .
i am still thinking of making a track of office sounds; you ever listen to the rhythm of a printer? . . .
regarding inspiration: it is usually there, you just need to call it forth. Uberzone said in an interview for Remix magazine that his little microrecorder was his favorite piece of gear. he just keeps it in his pocket, whips it out wherever, and talks ideas into, beatboxes, whatever. this is a great way to save those little thoughts we have! of course, people look at you funny, but well. . . .
Hi there
about the inspiration... I'm under heavy load these days, I have a release in 'bout two months and I haven't been able to get anything worth it out of my system. Now I took two weeks vacation and I booked a hotel somewhere in Sweden ... Nothing but mountains, my pulsar system and the internet(you never know what it might be good for) even my girlfriend stays at home. Only thing that counts for me now is to get that stress out of me (hope that will only take 2-3 days) and than start getting those beats rolling ...
just my 2 (euro)cents If it doesn't work well my recordlabel will probably dump me. Maybe I'll start my own ... who knows
Greetz and see ya soon in Sweden
about the inspiration... I'm under heavy load these days, I have a release in 'bout two months and I haven't been able to get anything worth it out of my system. Now I took two weeks vacation and I booked a hotel somewhere in Sweden ... Nothing but mountains, my pulsar system and the internet(you never know what it might be good for) even my girlfriend stays at home. Only thing that counts for me now is to get that stress out of me (hope that will only take 2-3 days) and than start getting those beats rolling ...
just my 2 (euro)cents If it doesn't work well my recordlabel will probably dump me. Maybe I'll start my own ... who knows
Greetz and see ya soon in Sweden
Hmmm... Sweden eh? Sounds tempting!
Thanks to everyone here for your excellent advice. I felt a bit embarrassed creating this thread but I thought if I can't ask such a question here, where can I? As usual, you guys didn't let me down and for that I'm really grateful.
I'm going to try out all your helpful suggestions. When I sum it all up, it seems the key to getting creative is to not try! This is the exact opposite of what I had been doing so I'm bound to get something out of it. Kinda zen-like isn't it...
So now I'm gonna go out and enjoy my Saturday, forget about music, dismiss any tunes that enter my head and hopefully you guys will see me post something really zany in the music forum soon!
Cheers,
Retro
PS. Wayne - you just had to mention the dreaded Saturn Return didn't ya! About 6 or 7 people have raised that with me in the past fortnight. Spooky...
Thanks to everyone here for your excellent advice. I felt a bit embarrassed creating this thread but I thought if I can't ask such a question here, where can I? As usual, you guys didn't let me down and for that I'm really grateful.
I'm going to try out all your helpful suggestions. When I sum it all up, it seems the key to getting creative is to not try! This is the exact opposite of what I had been doing so I'm bound to get something out of it. Kinda zen-like isn't it...
So now I'm gonna go out and enjoy my Saturday, forget about music, dismiss any tunes that enter my head and hopefully you guys will see me post something really zany in the music forum soon!
Cheers,
Retro
PS. Wayne - you just had to mention the dreaded Saturn Return didn't ya!
About 6 or 7 people have raised that with me in the past fortnight. Spooky...Yes, I had one of those (as did everyone i know in the Aust. performing arts world)On 2002-05-10 18:12, Retro wrote:
PS. Wayne - you just had to mention the dreaded Saturn Return didn't ya!
I'm 37 now - thank god writers block is out of the way!
I do find it easier nowadays, tho - perhaps i just worry about it less,or think about it differently.
learn csound (woo hoo, just got my csound book 3 days ago)...is my latest icebreaker .
i just figured i could benefit by learning something new, both as in being more informed and learned and in taking my thoughts away from composing stuff for a bit. and hey....once you start acclimating to csound you start to realize how cool and modular like it is. i don't expect many people to do this....hehe.
oh, and i got a bunch of good ideas from here. which i want to try.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IDM-Making/message/13291
something else i've been meaning to try, is modelling a few songs on songs i enjoy myself.
i've done that a little bit (borrowing elements, sound sources). but its worked really well for me in learning modular synthesis...so i figure it must be pretty aplicable to learning some more about composing, arranging, mixing and effects processing and ultimately making more "finished" tracks.
i had the "this sucks" thing in the begining , but now i don't really care so much. i just sort of do whatever without a whole lot of care about the end result. i have days which it seems i just can't do anything moderately interesting....so instead of just pushing i just change my plans for the day.
best.
//c
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: castol on 2002-05-10 21:21 ]</font>
. i just figured i could benefit by learning something new, both as in being more informed and learned and in taking my thoughts away from composing stuff for a bit. and hey....once you start acclimating to csound you start to realize how cool and modular like it is. i don't expect many people to do this....hehe.
oh, and i got a bunch of good ideas from here. which i want to try.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IDM-Making/message/13291
something else i've been meaning to try, is modelling a few songs on songs i enjoy myself.
i've done that a little bit (borrowing elements, sound sources). but its worked really well for me in learning modular synthesis...so i figure it must be pretty aplicable to learning some more about composing, arranging, mixing and effects processing and ultimately making more "finished" tracks.
i had the "this sucks" thing in the begining , but now i don't really care so much. i just sort of do whatever without a whole lot of care about the end result. i have days which it seems i just can't do anything moderately interesting....so instead of just pushing i just change my plans for the day.
best.
//c
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: castol on 2002-05-10 21:21 ]</font>