Unreliable power problem on my XITE

The Sonic Core XITE hardware platform for Scope

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yayajohn
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by yayajohn »

Heat? I've got my replacement pwr supply directly on top of a fan pointed upwards under my Xite. It stays warm but not hot.

petal
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by petal »

I don't doubt you, and I'm sure that those messages can be triggered by a dodgy hdmi connection. But as I said, my whole unit loses power. Some times only for a short while, other times for longer periods of time and I have to push the power button several times before lights in the power led comes back, which is why I doubt that my problem is a bad HDMI-connection.

petal
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by petal »

yayajohn wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 5:06 am
Heat? I've got my replacement pwr supply directly on top of a fan pointed upwards under my Xite. It stays warm but not hot.
A heat problem - I havn't explored that idea. Are you talking about the power supply or the XITE it self?

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t_tangent
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by t_tangent »

Sounds like a very similar thing that happens from time to time on one of my A16 Ultra. Sometimes and for no apparent reason the power goes on it then a few seconds later, sometimes less sometimes more it starts again. I remember it used to be much worse but nowadays it happens quite infrequently so I just live with it, but I am almost convinced it is the actual switch or related circuitry, and I found when it used to be worse that if I wiggled the switch gently from side to side or just ever so slightly pushed it as I was wiggling it then the power came on again. I think the switches are very similar on the A16u and Xite, not in my studio right now but will check later, so it may be a related issue you have. I never got it sorted as mine doesn’t happen so often now and I can’t really get to my A16U without moving everything.

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yayajohn
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by yayajohn »

petal wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 5:13 am
yayajohn wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 5:06 am
Heat? I've got my replacement pwr supply directly on top of a fan pointed upwards under my Xite. It stays warm but not hot.
A heat problem - I havn't explored that idea. Are you talking about the power supply or the XITE it self?
Don't know which but I sort of killed 2 birds with one stone by aiming the fan so it blows on both. Lots of people run their Xites fine without a fan so maybe it's nothing. For me I decided to just in case and so far I haven't had any issues with the power supply.
What t_tangent said might also be a factor as I also turn the power on my Xite with an external switch instead of the power button on the unit.
What valis has said here over and over really applies, you have to eliminate even the most remote possibilities to thoroughly troubleshoot a problem like this unless you have the proper testing gear. If I were you I'd go and get another power supply from a different manufacturer and try that, (I think mine was $12)
If all else fails then for sure send it to Holger. The Xite unit is well worth a trip across the pond and back.

petal
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by petal »

@t_tangent: I recall that you told about your wiggle technique, when we discussed the issue with the A16U where it takes a long time syncing up with the correct frequency. This problem is different, and I'm not able to provoke the problem to appear if I wiggle the power button on my Xite.

@yayajohn: I've tried with two different power supplies already, and unfortunately I experience the problem with both. I'm afraid I have to send it back to Holger, worrying that this could be a rather expensive repair, since the problem appears randomly. Sometimes several times a day, other times with days and weeks in between. My guess is that a new mobo in the unit wont be cheap :(

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t_tangent
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by t_tangent »

Ah right. Actually yes I was looking at your video file again and it does look like a different issue. Sorry about that. It's a shame there aren't any schematics, but then again since most of the XIte is SMD and requires a skilled technician and tools to do any serious work to it probably just as well. I can only suggest that perhaps a decent local tech can have a quick look and at least try to establish where the problem is, but even then they may not be able to fix it, so the only real course of action would be to send it to SC for repairs. I had to do that a couple of years ago for my Xite, not the same issue though, and they replaced the main board. Not cheap but was worthwhile. If you have tried everything you can think of but still can't resolve it, email support and see what they can do. Sorry I can't help more, and best of luck.

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yayajohn
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by yayajohn »

Well that really is a shame to hear you've reached the end with no solutions in sight.
I do not envy the tough decisions ahead for you.
Good luck.

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spacef
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by spacef »

I've had this on occasion but it depends on where I am located. My previous appartment did not cause any problem. The electricty was new and up to modern standard. I moved to a building where the electricty is older.
I have the "copy protection error" when I plug an usb device directly to my computer, and other ocvcasions.

For me it is about static electricty and may be quality of the electricity network of the building.
Now I plug usb stuff on a usb hub, and I have no problem in this case.

It does not happen randomly. Petal's problem looks different but in my case this kind of error has always been about static electricty and plugging/unplugging stuff while the computer is on (or moving the computer causing the hdmi cable to move and to cause the error, which happened in my previous appartment too).
plug-ins for scope
SpaceF website
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valis
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by valis »

If gear is running on different outlets in the room, or worse yet different circuits with different outlets, you may have a ground difference that can cause several problems. One is that you may get some small (millivolts, but measurable) when AC flows across the circuit from positive to neutral. The second is that noise which can normally be filtered out has a phase shift across both outlets, leading to very bizarre forms of noise.

Second is just 'bad ground'. Ground lift switches can help compensate for this, and when I face that issue I prefer Hum-X/EBtech style products that go either on the power side or on the audio cables (when necessary). I carry this stuff in my gig bag as well btw, in addition to having rack power units and floor units that compensate for voltage dips, filter the power (noise removal via filters) and can help identify when there's a ground issue.

With this latter case, I had to run my own ground stake 2 homes ago to remove ground problems, and things worked considerably better.

There's a thread here somewhere where we discussed not just the products I linked above (easily searchable) but also ways to deal with ground noise on analog cable runs (where to break ground and why).

The last concern would be the PSU in the computer itself. Not all PSU's are of equal build, even when they have the same end-brand name on the unit. I use http://www.jonnyguru.com/ forums (and a few others) to try to research the exact factory that my units are coming from, and then when I have issues I check for voltage issues and ripple noise. Note that HWMonitor (Pro & Non-Pro) and other simple utilities often completely misreport voltages, so I rely on paid tools like AIDA64.

Hopefully you either have or will eliminate such culprits before having to send the unit in, just to save time & $ if possible. Best of luck!

petal
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by petal »

Thank you for chiming in! That was my goal for posting here, to eliminate all possibilities before sending it back to Holger.

All my equipment runs on the same circuit, but different outlets. Not all equipment is grounded, but what can easily be grounded is grounded. Might be an avenue to investigate before involving Holger in this.

This is the second apartment that I experience this problem in, so the pixie moved with me from the old place - along with other stuff, but that is off topic... :o

Also, I don't experience any static electricity, not small shocks or anything, but I can't completely rule this possibility out.

Still though, when I experienced the problem last. All power was gone from the unit for several seconds. No light in the power led, and I had to actively push the power button several times before it came back. Which makes me think it is internal in the unit (having ruled out the power supplies). I think it is either a bad capacitor, an internal lose connection or bad soldering point.

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Bud Weiser
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by Bud Weiser »

petal wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 9:46 am
All power was gone from the unit for several seconds. No light in the power led, and I had to actively push the power button several times before it came back. Which makes me think it is internal in the unit (having ruled out the power supplies). I think it is either a bad capacitor, an internal lose connection or bad soldering point.
With this info, I´d double check the power switch itself too.

:)

Bud

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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by dawman »

My power buttons are always on and I take these units wherever I go.

Never any problems and I’m playing some serious shitholes these days.


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petal
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by petal »

I could fairly easy try to not use the power button for a while and see if it makes a difference.

Even though I don't experience any static electricity, how would one check if there is a problem with static electricity?

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garyb
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by garyb »

a grounding issue would be just as big a problem. check the wiring...

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Bud Weiser
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by Bud Weiser »

petal wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 1:36 am
I could fairly easy try to not use the power button for a while and see if it makes a difference.
When there´s a powerswitch issue, mechanical and/or electrical, it doesn´t make a difference.

The powerswitch is soldered to the XITE mainboard.
On the pic I have, I recognize 3 soldering joints on the left side of the powerswitch and I guess there are 3 more on the other side.
The switch itself doesn´t have to be the culprit, maybe (one of) it´s contacts (is) are.
Behind the switch there are 2 caps which I´d check too.
In the end it´s possible to measure at the switch´s contacts if the switch itself is worn out.
It´s strange you have to push the switch repeatedly to get the unit powering up.

:)

Bud

petal
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by petal »

Bud Weiser wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:25 am

It´s strange you have to push the switch repeatedly to get the unit powering up.

:)

Bud
Well, there's not much else to try when the power fails :) It doesn't mean it's actually the switch which is the problem.

At some point I thought the problem could be the power plug going into the XITE which was the problem. So I jiggled that and took it in and out a few times to secure a good connection until the power came back.

Now, I'm pretty sure it is not the plug, but that exercise "somehow" did the trick as does the turning the powerswitch on and off.

Ditykman
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Re: Unreliable power problem on my XITE

Post by Ditykman »

Hello

AN other suggestion off topic? :)
Before I used to have problems with midi ( my ableton push was sending a lot of midi message record ... randomly... very boring)
I change the power supply to one without ground like this
https://www.amazon.fr/gp/product/B001W3 ... UTF8&psc=1

Nows it works fine with random clicks on w10 but the push works.

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