PlanetZ forums - scopeusers.com

Hey guys
I was just "gifted" a server. I'd like to run my DAW on this if
possible. My regular computer is kind of ancient. It's running
Server 2003. Just wondering if anyone else is using this and
how their Scope cards were working.

Thanks
Carmine

in case you got a valid license for it (unlikely with a 'gift'): sell it
otherwise your best option is format c:
here's an example of a great Scope host for about $100... (if you can get along with 2 PCI slots)

M$ servers later than Win2K are overbloated piles of crap... imo
you can't even read the full list of rubbish that's included and active in any reasonable amount of time
I was shocked about SBS 2008 recently and was told 2003 wouldn't be any 'better' in clumsiness... as I plead for downgrade...

cheers, Tom

Hi Tom
In the first place, I do have a legit licence. This computer was
given to me by my ex-pastor (and very good friend)
So, I'm not sure as to what you're trying to tell me.
Okay, I get the "bloated" bit and such. SO......will it run my DAW
is essentially what I'm asking. OR will it run like crap or not at all.

I checked your link. Yeah, I could do that, but this computer
specs out quite a bit better. Sorry, don't have the exact spec list
in front of me. But I would have to do some upgrades to something else,
to get what I've got in this one. It's a great bit of hardware that I would like
to make use of if at all possilbe. That's all......

Thanks

it'll probably run.
you may have a few tweaks to do.
i'd get an XP Home(if you are going to run v4 or 5.1) or Win7 home license(if you want to run v5.1) myself.

carmine wrote: So, I'm not sure as to what you're trying to tell me. ...

ok, I'll try to be a bit more clear...
first of all it depends on WHAT version of 2003 server is running and WHICH services are configured.
Your mileage varies from totally customized machine that does nothing else but provide terminal services up to the 'full package' as you often find in Small Business Server.
Full means: domain control, user and environment management, firewall, external backups for users, SQL Server, mail server , file server, web server, java applications as server side stuff, telephony, print services... and probably a few I forgot about. All implemented as a million of obscure 'services' with spider web-like dependency among each other.
Before you have understood what's going on and sorted it out, you would have done 10 full installations of anything else...

Such a system would NOT RUN your DAW to any reasonable degree, in particular if it's installed on a 'better' computer (as you call it) than the one I've picked out.
I have been through all this in the last couple of weeks, though for 2 different systems.
One is a machine that was supposed to provide ONLY terminal services.
From my experience with Win2K server I considered it fairly simple to 'deconfigure' anything I wouldn't need and bought for licensing reasons a Small Business package.
Only to find out I was as wrong as can be. They WANT ME to have all and everything installed and it would be hell to get rid of the default.
I should have bought the Standard versions and treat it with a pre-install configure to remove what's not needed BEFORE installation.
Once it's setup, I had the impression it's almost impossible to remove unwanted items. That about Server 2003. To be honest I had 2008, but (as mentioned) was told that 2003 wouldn't be much different.

The other thing was running Scope on a P67 board with an i5 CPU, which is unquestionable a good bang of calculation power for the buck.
I used an Asus board under Win7/64 and and Intel board under Win7/32.
Both failed with PCI overflows at the 5th instance of Masterverb, a ridiculous PCI performance.
One instance of Sonic Core's ambience reverb and you couldn't even get a couple of Asio channels running.
It was a complete desaster, seriously.

I installed Scope back onto my internet machine which is miles from being optimized and gets all kind of crap installed up and down...
This is a Gigabyte EP41 with a CoreDuo 7200... el cheapo, and Scope 5 performed flawless - not one PCI issue, but with only 9 DSPs the juice ran out pretty fast of course. at least it ran 12 instances of Masterverb until that point...
I remember the calculation power of the i5, which was almost twice the 7200 and will compare it to an 8400 I just got.
As Scope isn't multicore interested anyway, I also took a P4 3ghz (for a few bucks) to put it in a spare board and check it's performance.

Do as you like, but my figures are real world experience on existing hardware - not some artificial benchamrk specs or something I read on the internet...
Scope with PCI cards does IN NO WAY benefit from anything a 'modern' chipset or CPU provides.
To be precise: it's ALL wasted. It may run, but not better than a supposedly lame system of the past when they really cared about PCI performance.

cheers, Tom

Well, I asked and Tom gave!!!! LOL!!!
Thank you very much for such a detailed answer.
I do appreciate it very much. I am just in the process
of "re setting" up my rig after not doing this for a while.

I will certainly look into each aspect in more detail
and see what exactly is under the hood of this thing.

Thanks so much again.
Carmine

you're welcome - I've been pretty fu**ed up by this myself ...
replacement of the 7200 by an 8400 was ok, except mounting of the cooler. I'm not that comfortable with Intel's clip scheme at all... what a rubbish.
Anyway... the EP41 'messed' box runs Scope nicely and in calculation power it's 25% below the i5.
The latter has way faster memory chips (forgot about that...), and I have no idea if that's of any influence for the respective benchmark.

I'll save you the details of what failed on other systems I've tried (to make something useful of)...
But I suspect none of the 'classic' mobos is cool with Win7 - leaving that to XP instead.
I've had Win7 in mind mostly for it's out of the box support for SSDs (not interested in speed, but silence), that's why I tried it.

Strangely I'm under the impression that Win7/64 (which I have on an ASUS P67) runs better than it's 32bit counterpart, at least according to user 'experience'.
But for any such (modern) system I'd strongly recommand an XITE instead of PCI card 'recycling' - imho the latter is not worth the effort.
Just leave those cards in their familiar XP environment. It's neither lame nor 'outdated' ... as long as you can do something productive on it

cheers, Tom

I hear what you're saying Tom. However, I would like take advantage
of the horsepower though. Especially for VSTi's. I tend to rely heavily
on that stuff since I used to do mostly "synth pop" kind of stuff.
I may just throw XP or 7 on this new box and see
what happens. Can't really afford to get another interface at
this point either. I mean, yes, I could get something "cheap" but
I've been way too spoiled with my Creamware cards and quite frankly,
there's nothing else I would want. I work in music retail and sell this stuff
every day. There is litterally NOTHING outside buying a PT HD rig that even
comes close to what we have in the Creamware/Sonic Core world. And now with
ProTools 9, it's a no brainer to stay in this environment. I use Nuendo, but now
the possibility of never having to say "no I don't use ProTools" is very cool.
You literally can "have it all" so to speak.

Anyhoo....thanks again for your input.
And to quote The Joker....."and here we... go".......

sure - if you have lots of VSTis (which may be optimized for multicore CPUs) a modern board is cool with Scope.
But afaik that's a very specific item (of trial and error), at least you might have to sacrifice Scope's reverbs for a reasonable amount of Asio channels.
If you can get along without Asio, you may end with some reverbs, almost certainly reduced in comparison to 'classic' boards.

The only point that's clear imo ist that Server 2003 in a 'regular' configuration is a killer (in the worst sense imaginable) for any DAW.
But it's a fairly expensive piece of software - that's why I suggested 'sell it'.
You won't have to look long for a customer, as you have a legit license - and it will most likely finance an RME9632 or better.
Imho you can't have it all (with Scope PCI) in one box with current chipsets. XITE is a different story...
The old cards NEED fast and undisturbed access to main memory for reverb/delay effects, there's no cheating on that

cheers, Tom