PlanetZ forums - scopeusers.com

perception...

and observation

... and I point out that this post was created by an owner of a XITE

again, this is just insulting.

don't care?
if SonicCore didn't CARE, there wouldn't be a product at all. it's not like making a high end dsp interface is profitable for ANY company.

you want small? Neve when all those beautiful mixers were made.
UAD, when the original compressors were made.
SoundDelux the maker of some of the finest microphones ever made.
Orban, a company whose EQs are still some of the best.

if you want McDonalds, then you GET McDonalds.
if you want food from a 5 star restuarant, don't expect coupons or happy hour specials.
if you buy a whore and don't want diseases, don't buy off of the street.

NONE of the reasons for not wanting the product are in any way related to it's function. they're all about the lack of clowns and acrobats. isn't the product itself more important than anything? S|C doesn't have money for all these nice touchy feely things, even though they'd be really cool. there is only money to keep the company going.

chris13 wrote:The only thing which would change my mind about Sonic Core, it's a standalone unit like the Noah, but with a modular inside, a little as clavia but with the sound quality from creamware/SC/sharcs

I don't see how it would be possible to have a modular IV in standalone unit without a pc screen, alpha keyboard and why not a mouse (it will be more convenient) ...

chris13 wrote:maybe that members of SC staff read the post, that would make them perhaps become aware of waitings and the reasons of the mistrust of some interested people.
Or maybe an intervention, here, from one of this staff with a few elements to contradict me or dissipate some trouble
But I believe they don't care, simply

They DO care, even on personal base.
It's hard to know tho, for those potential buyers who are not familiar with the company and it's past.

If I indeed understand all of you, SC staff stay in the shadow and silence, spread no piece of news, do not communicate with anyone, dont know if the next week it's still exist (for the next activation keys...maybe mailing to santa claus or mahatma gandhi : who knows ?)
all this would be very cool and proof of an exceptional commitment. Amazing.

wtf are you saying?

am i not communicating with you?

have i not provided keys to anyone?

have you written to tech support and not gotten an answer?

once keys are generated, they are good forever. even if S|C were gone, if you backup your keyfile, you'll never need new keys(unless you buy a new plugin).

GaryB is one of the sc staff ? Ok OK, dont know that
So you can note that some people can be unquiet about the lack of news or "noise" - For some guys, investment can be consequent, and one remains on right to put some questions about the reasons of that or simply about the health of your company..

Dude, if you don't like the answers you're getting from here, obviously your asking the wrong people. If I was you I would send Holger an email. Tell him you would like to buy XITE but your concerned about the 'perceived' lack of hand holding.

Either he gives you some sort or reassurance, or he won't, then make your decision based on that.

I can tell you I have in most cases got the answers I'm after from support, GaryB or Holger himself. If you have a genuine enquiry they respond most times - lets say 85%. That's way more than answers I've got from Steinberg - in fact I never got any responses from Steinberg, only half baked non committal answer from thier forum moderator in one occassion only.

Propellorhead are next best to S|C.

investment?

you should be able to use the XITE for at least 20 years. here's one of my clients:
http://www.williamgoldstein.com/
he has an 18 year old PCI card in a current Dual XEON machine.

by the way, my personal clients include the producer of the latest Anita Baker album and Justin Timberlake's music director.

investment?
let's compare to Cubase, ProTools, Sonar or any similar expensive software, heck, Photoshop....
this is what's normal for the computer industry, 2 years later, not only is it obsolete, but there is no more support. promised fixes were never made and even if they were, you must REPURCHASE the software for the fixes and new bugs. obviously, there are mitigating circumstances even here, and of course, even with a few bugs, all of those products are more than useful. my point is that even though they provide you with lots of shiney encouraging braggadocio, these companies are LESS trustworthy than SonicCore, who has supported cards made by another company and who has continued with the product regardless of sales figures or slander campaigns and attempts to destroy the company through hacking. yes, these things happen.

the worst things that can be said about S|C is that there isn't money for wild advertising and publicity campaigns, there have been problems completing the cross platform, open sourced version of Scope that isn't really needed desperately, and that the old Samplers haven't been rewritten. as to providing keys, answering emails from customers, having new plugins from 3rd party makers and the commitment to exist(something that NO ONE can PROMISE), SonicCore has not done anything to be worthy of mistrust.

It's more, more clear for me now, thanks Gary and really sorry if i hurt you.

it's no problem. i understand the issues and hubird is correct about perception. that's why i like to clear up misconceptions and/or perceptions, if i can...

Understand that i have read on my side, some testimony on french forums with guys...mmmmh... A little angry after some mishap... Audiofanzine to put a name on this one

I just read the last posts and would like to add my point of view as long term owner of 4 Pulsar cards and owner of a Triple Dat card, meaning I have experience with Soniccore and Creamware since 1994.

In the beginning, all given promises were bigger than what was kept. The ideas behind were always outstanding and ahead of the time, which was part of the problem. Trying to work with these products ate a lot of my time dealing with computer stuffwhich had never been my interest. Nevertheless, in the long run the promises were kept and more than fulfillled, with a permanent delay though. It seemed, that the company permanently struggled with the commercial side of the story but was strongly committed to their good ideas and products.

All I want to do with these cards can be done today and the stability is absolutely OK if you follow the hardware advises given here. Had a service case soem years ago and everything was done very correctly. I didn't have bad experiences in the last years. So from todays point of view I would have to say THUMB UP - where is teh next revolutionary idea ?

Big thanks to Garyb for his constant input in this forum that helped me several times over the years.

Wolferich wrote:I just read the last posts and would like to add my point of view as long term owner of 4 Pulsar cards and owner of a Triple Dat card, meaning I have experience with Soniccore and Creamware since 1994.

I have 3x Pulsar II and virtually no experience with Scope but I can say it has great potential given the awkward and often non-existant marketing hype that surrounds "normal" products.

Maybe garyb is the saviour of Sonic Core since I sure as hell would not have been able to get onto the platform but my thoughts have now turned to server farming with multiple cards since S|C don't exist in my country.

As to the future, it's working on Windows 8.1 which is an accomplishment in and of itself. The fact that I can run this stuff in a 64 bit, modern computing environment is testament to a solid work ethic on Creamwares' part so here's to the future of DSP and ITB mixing!

yeah, a little slander really hurts a lot.(of course the kind words really help a lot!)

you wouldn't believe what people have said to me and called me because S|C charges for v5.1. the Scope cards require a driver and the software to function. the driver connects the card to windows and the program contains the gui that loads the dsps so that the card can work. it took more than 2 1/2 years to make v5.1. Creamware, the original company that made the PCI cards went out of business more than 6 years ago, just as Vista was released. naturally, they never made Vista/win7/win8 software or drivers. now, after people have had cards for 8 years, they think S|C should toil for 2 1/2 years for free. that's just one source of unfair criticism.

yes, it would be better if S|C had been able to rewrite the STS samplers to work in 64bit windows by now. the fact is, that what's in Scope is worth much more than the samplers. they will involve some 1-2years of work without doing much of anything else and they are one of the least used parts of Scope. also, native samplers are great these days(compared to 18 years ago). the samplers still work perfectly in a 32bit environment. if they are really important, it's probably worth having them in a 32bit computer. this isn't a hard-ass statement. it's just a reality.

XITEs have been in limited supply. it's difficult to make enough fast enough, but make them we do. an XITE costs about $4000. a 15dsp card used to cost $2000. even in the worst case scenario, an XITE does the work of 6 or so 15dsp cards(in the best case it does the work of 10 15dsp cards). people have been up in arms about the level of performance. all in all, the most vehement complaints come from the most casual users. the more serious the user and the more experience the uiser has with truly HIGH-END audio gear, the happier they are. when i first got Scope, it was more than a revalation to me. that's why i'm involved today. i KNOW it's good.

I'm convinced. Most hard now to convince my wife

@garyb, instead of saying S|C have hard @sses, maybe you mean't to say they are hard nosed? I don't know them personally but i think with you on board you ameliorate any problems and can see through the wicked ways of end users, since i for one think Sonic Core should again have another special in order to keep faith with fans and try hards alike.

i'm sure we'll have another sale sooner or later....

chris13-i'm glad to hear that! if and when that happens, be assured that i'll be available to help, both here and by writing to support. also, the users here are experts and can help you through most learning pains.... there's so much in Scope, that there are users here that know things even the original programmers might not have thought of.