PlanetZ forums - scopeusers.com

you really should wait until the card arrives...
and THEN do a simple but thorough inspection of the features
after that everything will be much clearer
(telling from your words you don't seem to have much clue of it atm)
ASIO has nothing to do with Midi, it's not even remotely related

if you send a midi note/trigger to a synth drum or sampler within Scope (STS) the pulse will reach the monitor in less than a millisecond
it doesn't need any kind of software driver (no Asio, no WDM) to do this - because it's hardware

you can have parallel signal pathes in Scope
what goes to your monitor can also be routed simultaneously to a software driver (let's assume WDM) output
Cubase will pick it up from that driver some 100 ms later and write it to a track (if set to the respective channel)
you can ignore this huge latency, as you can't hear no data anyway
but Cubase knows about the offset (if you're so kind to teach it one time)
then it will calculate all playback positions accordingly and everything is in sync

latency comes into the game only if your drums are VST Instruments and you want to play them live
that would be a big pita with WDM as it's buffer for CPU processing is quite large.

Asio was invented as a cure to that situation, it's way off from realtime but sufficient for most uses
anything between 5 and 15 milliseconds is acceptable
one should not overstress the issue as each meter of distance from the monitors adds about 4 ms latency
(the time the sound need to travel in air)

cheers, Tom

astroman wrote:ASIO has nothing to do with Midi, it's not even remotely related

Of course I'm talking about playing live MIDI drums

if you send a midi note/trigger to a synth drum or sampler within Scope (STS) the pulse will reach the monitor in less than a millisecond
it doesn't need any kind of software driver (no Asio, no WDM) to do this - because it's hardware

Likely the reason Scope was attractive in the first place, I hope it has many dynamics

you can have parallel signal pathes in Scope
what goes to your monitor can also be routed simultaneously to a software driver (let's assume WDM) output
Cubase will pick it up from that driver some 100 ms later and write it to a track (if set to the respective channel)
you can ignore this huge latency, as you can't hear no data anyway
but Cubase knows about the offset (if you're so kind to teach it one time)
then it will calculate all playback positions accordingly and everything is in sync

Not really into recording (yet), as my bass lines don't yet rock and I prefer to program drums so frameworks of songs come together more quickly rather than focusing on one song for too long.

latency comes into the game only if your drums are VST Instruments and you want to play them live that would be a big pita with WDM as it's buffer for CPU processing is quite large.

That's what I want to do!

Asio was invented as a cure to that situation, it's way off from realtime but sufficient for most uses anything between 5 and 15 milliseconds is acceptable one should not overstress the issue as each meter of distance from the monitors adds about 4 ms latency (the time the sound need to travel in air)

cheers, Tom

well, if you program your tracks from various pieces by mouseclicks, you don't really play live
there's a much larger timeframe than sitting behind the kit and drumming to monitors (or with cans on)
for the latter a really low latency setting will certainly help - for programming it's just a convenience

but of course the system CAN do Asio, so if a part is done more or less live-like set Cubase to Asio
set the 2nd programming and backing Cubase to WDM

cheers, Tom

Thanks again Astroman.

I've set it at 8096 buffers with no sync or buffers lost on my UA-1G although there is a lag in the project cursor and some drop outs, not really usable but a good experiment (haven't done it for ages).

For the record we are talking about MME yes?

garyb wrote:

Bud Weiser wrote: I never tried that,- but what about 2 ASIO drivers on the same machine,- one for SCOPE and the other for a RME card p.ex.?
Can 2 different ASIO drivers exist and work simultaneously on the machine, each one for a different card ?

Bud

yeah, that should work.

Thx, cool ! You´re the expert !

garyb wrote: freezing a track and/or actually commiting to audio would be an easier solution though.

Yeah, that´s right for the recording/mixing scenario.

But I was also thinking about the live/realtime scenario playing keyboards in a rig composed from hardware, SCOPE DSP and native software.
Now and after your highly appreciated info,- I think about using SCOPE/XITE in SCOPE mode using SCOPE ASIO driver and w/ NI Kontakt standalone or as a plugin in a VST host plus OPX-Pro II p.ex.,- AND Phead Reason 6.5 w/ RME ASIO driver/card exclusively.
There could be a ADAT loop back between XITE-1 and RME card or dedicated main outputs of both the XITE-1 and RME card summed in a passive premixer/summing box or monitor controller unit like SPL, then going to the monitor amp.
Could be, the 2nd solution is lowest latency for gigging and the 1st soluition (loopback) being o.k. for recording.

My motherboard worked stable and low latency w/ RME PCI card in PCI slot #2 w/ exclusive IRQ,- it has native PCI support,- and it works great w/ XITE-1 PCIe too.
I don´t expect it not working w/ PCIe and PCI simultaneously and it was all about the drivers question.

I see it only as a workaround until SCOPE 6 will be released and 64Bit w/ more RAM and all DSP devices working is no issue anymore.

So, I´d be able to stay w/ XP for the next 3 or 4 month as also w/ the old dual core machine which saves money and time.

thx again

Bud

for live, you might try just using a lower overhead vst host like Bidule. http://www.plogue.com/products/bidule/

it has a Scope-like interface and can easily host all of your VSTis and rewired apps with free routing. it is a VERY light program and it's plenty stable. i think that this would work better than two soundcards with two ASIO systems.

garyb wrote:for live, you might try just using a lower overhead vst host like Bidule. http://www.plogue.com/products/bidule/

it has a Scope-like interface and can easily host all of your VSTis and rewired apps with free routing. it is a VERY light program and it's plenty stable. i think that this would work better than two soundcards with two ASIO systems.

Thx for reminding me on that host !
Many years ago, I had it on a slow single core Pentium 4 machine and it worked fine.
I simply forgot it later, maybe because the machine itself was not able to load much and it expired anyway after some time. That were the times I worked w/ a 15 DSP SCOPE PCI and SCOPE 4.0 only.

Now, when I go to Bidule downloads section - http://www.plogue.com/downloads/ -
it says "the demo version" expires april 1st 2013, which would be ideal to check out w/ XITE until Winter NAMM and Musikmesse is over.
Is the actual "demo" version fully functional until it expires ?
Can´t find any info on this on their website.

In fact, for the moment it´s hard to make decisions and buy something new until there will be news about ParseQ and SCOPE 6.

Bud

yeah, i think the demo functions fully. it's cheap anyway.

garyb wrote:yeah, i think the demo functions fully.

cool, - thx !

garyb wrote: it's cheap anyway.

Yes, it is.

But there´s the dream ...
Power up your controllers, launch SCOPE 6 project on XITE-1 and ParseQ, insert 4 or 5 VSTi, launch Reason and fly.
With Reason 7 I expect we see MIDI Out and much more 3rd party and Phead REs,- maybe the end of all VST for me.
Because the Mayans failed,- 2013 is the year ...

From that point, it might become hard selling all the native VST hosts and plugins collected.

Bud