Q: what are the advantages of CW DSP vs. native VSTI-plugs

[astroman]

On 2004-02-11 22:49, Spirit wrote:
...And whatever you do you'll need a soundcard, and if you're serious about sound then you'll want to get a good one...

one of my most stunning experiences was NI's B4 Hammond which did sound exactly the same played through a SoundBlaster (the PCI ultra-cheapo) and my PulsarOne.
I swear it was impossible, but it was easy to distinguish the B4 from CWA's B2003, so I cannot be totally dumb.

The controversary between DSP and CPU processing originates (imho) mostly from statements by CPU-only users who call people 'idiots' to spent a lot of cash on 'unnecessary and outdated equipment'.

They believe in superior processing power (it's newer, so it must be...) by reading totally irrelevant numbers.
The 'power' of a progam depends on how smart it's implemented - and if you look at those piles of code that cannot be smart at all.

You have to face the fact that unless someone rewrites an essential part of the libraries currently used to progam native stuff there won't be any improvement in sound quality.
You can process crap with 12 GHZ - it will remain crap because it's inherent.
THAT has nothing to do with native versus DSP coding.
It's just a matter of general software quality.

cheers, Tom

[valis]

The analogy there would be their code 'libraries' versus Creamware's "atoms". Both are the building blocks for the average developer (ones that don't have the time/ability/resources to create their own), and both affect the processing demands and precision of the output.

I might add that a large part of the problem comes from topics like "what are the advantages of CW DSP vs. native VSTI-plugs". Most users probably aren't going to forgoe native processing & synthesis entirely but use them alongside their DSP card(s). Do UAD-1 & Powercore users use those cards alone and nothing else?

The question might be better phrased "what are the advantages of using CW DSP in addition to native VSTI-plugs alone". Instead of trying to prove one or the other superior we can then discuss why adding a ~$1000 dsp card with audio i/o to your existing setup enhances digital audio production.

[fortune]

hhmmm ... just yesterday a friend of mine was here and he claimed, he'd never go for what he called "outdated solutions" like a DSP-Card as his PC-system offers a huge amount of ressources for virtual instruments and even if he'd run out of ressources he'd rather buy a 2nd PC which is a lot cheaper than a DSP-solution. Thus it is not so easy to argue against that in terms of processing performance, no. of instances etc.
Anyway it is not just a small amount of money one spends on a DSP-board. I'm still not sure what to prefer.

[garyb]

the dsp board augments ANY native solution(not runng some form of unix).this "new is better" thing is obviously bullshit!have you checked the prices of vintage guitars,synths,mic pres or mics lately?and check how many new things are recreations of those old things.

the GOOD stuff NEVER becomes useless and obsolete!sometimes i wonder why people are buying things.....are they looking for something usefull or do they just want to brag about having the newest,biggest toy?

one more time,it's not either-or,nor is it all-or-nothing.the cpu is like a general practioner.he can handle most all of your medical needs and even though he probably could do brain surgery,for that it might be best to get a specialist. how about a neurosurgeon(dsp card)?...even though neuro
surgeons are more expensive hour by hour compared to gps.....



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: garyb on 2004-02-12 13:07 ]</font>

[Michu]

Fortune,

when i had my moment of doubt
i asked myself what should i get to replace it.
My answer to me was, that only audio interface offering (remotely) comparable routing flexibility would be RME, and i'd still need some modular system for my more exotic synth fancies, ie either Reaktor or Clavia.
After adding up those 2 positions Pulsar didn't seem so expensive as before

BTW, Chris, when it comes to granular wavetravel mangling stuff, Reaktor wins with Modular easily. when it comes to VA it is teh other way around. most nice sounding VA ensambles i've heard tend to rely on distortion or massive unison. OTOH if it sounds cool, who cares

[zezappa]

...donT worry, Fortune

both Native and DSP systems are very bad indeed!

...any can give the toasts in time at early morning