I'm sold! More questions...

[Mr Arkadin]

Maybe SC should just pull the samplers from the Scope download completely

I hope you mean "from 64Bit installers" download ...

Yeah, that's what I meant. Just don't have it in there. You don't miss what you never had (new users will probably be 64-bit I would imagine).

[Bud Weiser]

I don't like those huge sample libraries anyway, though... So please don't let the STS samplers die.

+1 !

I´m thinking about a build of a humble, small, lightweight, all-in-all very portable machine not requiring much cooling and just only w/ shrinked OS and SCOPE installed,- exclusively for XITE ...
Maybe 1HU or small beauty case format.

Such machine possibly doesn´t run NI Kontakt well and w/ "multis" streaming from disk.
And for the music I have in mind when gigging, I don´t need many samples at all, maybe a few and in that case all the AKAI and EMU stuff I have is still fine and loads fast.

I don´t play large piano and/ or orchestral libraries live, I use hardware instruments instead.
My AKAI and EMU hardware samplers are both bulky 3HU units and require separate flightcases incl. additional SCSI drives.
That´s too much today.
XITE-1 running STS and having some sample banks converted from AKAI CDs and EMU EoS into SF2 is a good solution for me.
STS sounds so much better than most native VST sample players existing.
NONE of my AKAI CD stuff sounds right in any VSTI, not in NI-Kontakt, not in Steini Halion as also not in Samplelord and such.
They all do the same, playing the sample data only, but the sound of the hardware is missing.

STS on DSP has a sound and that´s great.

Bud

[tlaskows]

Only some complain...

I am not complaining and will not use 32bit. I paid good money for my 16GB of RAM and I paid good money for my Windows 7 Ultimate. Well, it came with two CDs, one 32bit, one 64bit...

Scope works fine in 64 bit, just please remove the stuff that does not work. Well, I can just take my 5 minutes and delete it myself I guess

back some 5 years ago I was rocking 6 cores hard with 20GB of RAM. But I'm trying to take it easy now. No need for a beast computer when most of the stuff runs on DSPs

-Tom

[Bud Weiser]

But when dropping more than $3K on a piece of digital gear it does give one pause when you start hearing about a lot of "issues" and their "work-a-rounds."

I know what you mean, but you´ll probably hear it always in relation to digital gear and when listening carefully.
Digital isn´t perfect at all and it´s never bug free.

Almost any native application and plugin being installed here is buggy more or less,- investigate in depth and you´ll see.
"workaround" is one of the most used words in the music software industry.

And when you think the code burned into eproms you find in vintage synths and modules is bug free, you´re wrong.

Since software is in the ballpark, workarounds rule.

When you want to get rid of that, you have to go completely analogue, no preset memory thus no processor and electromagnetic instruments like in the 60s and 70s.

Ironically that is what they try to mimik in software today, including hiss and hum, wow and flutter and s##t ...



Bud

[garyb]

and the mention of price is a joke anyway.

in Scope is something called PsyQ. the hardware device that it's based on and that it sounds identical to(the hardware device is also digital), costs about $2000 itself.

one vintage minimoog is about $1700-2500 in great shape, a little less in rough shape.

the amount of stuff that can be used in an XITE at one time makes it stupid cheap. compare it to free or pirated vsts and it looks expensive, but Scope is in another league compared to most native products. the ones that achieve similar levels of sound quality eat cpus for breakfast. Scope needs to be compared to hardware. again, it's flawed and not perfect, but it's more than worth the price.

i have a partner who purchased a Waves bundle for $2000. it doesn't do anything that he can't do in scope and it doesn't work in his new version of Protools. there's no reason for it not to work in Protools, Avid and Waves just made it be that way. the upgrade is like $400, just to use the same plugins in the newer version of Protools. where's the value there? that kind of thing gets WAY more expensive than Scope. there are VERY famous and important professional producers using 15-18 year old Scope cards and the paid a measly $150 to upgrade Scope to use those cards in current computers running win7 and win10. i know this because they are my clients. in the long term, Scope is the most inexpensive platform available. people are just too stubborn, confused and/or hypnotized by the computer industry to see this. these users are happy to spend small amounts of money constantly for products that are less finished than Scope and that won't be used more than a year or two.

[tlaskows]

People only care about their hair

oops sorry, I've watched too much youtube in my life. I wouldn't say I've been missing it

The problem is that 99% of the people I personally know are really stubborn. They will not change their ways. I always try to give an useful piece of advice based on my experiences from the past, but no one gives a sh!t... No, that advice is not related to Scope, but that's how people are. They don't listen.

-Tom

[dante]

Maybe SC should just pull the samplers from the Scope download completely

I hope you mean "from 64Bit installers" download ...

Yeah, that's what I meant. Just don't have it in there. You don't miss what you never had (new users will probably be 64-bit I would imagine).

Removing it from 64 bit installers already has a bit of a consensus here ..
http://forums.planetz.com/viewtopic.php ... er#p316300

[hubird]

We can have all the right we have, but PR wise we are in defence.
The point is...nothing happens.
Too much 'lost ends'.
32/64 bit compatibility aspects, lack of sound snippets, lack of smart video's...
Nothing happens.

[tlaskows]

What do you mean?

[hubird]

PR wise...

You don't want this (relevant) discussion to be needed with every possible new user.

Numbers sold count, being right doesn't

So I'd say clean up the compatibility mess, and work on a nice selection of sound examples plus instruction video's.
It shows you're alive

[tlaskows]

I agree...

But I don't think it's our responsibility to market this thing. Sure, we could take some time to do it, but S|C should try a little harder...

-Tom

[hubird]

it's a choice where to put energy in.
Some action is urgent I think, and that's what I was talking about.
On the (very) long term there's Scope 6, but there's a bridge in time needed.

I agree...

But I don't think it's our responsibility to market this thing. Sure, we could take some time to do it, but S|C should try a little harder...

-Tom

That's what I'm saying

You don't want this (relevant) discussion to be needed with every possible new user.

[tlaskows]

Yes, a 6 page long thread just for someone that was looking for answers to some simple questions and some demos...

Hmm

-Tom

[hubird]

that's what i mean

So I'd say clean up the compatibility mess, and work on a nice selection of sound examples plus instruction video's.
It shows you're alive

[tlaskows]

It's 4:35am in netherlands. You don't sleep like me??

-Tom

[hubird]

I like the nightly hours...

[tlaskows]

I know the feeling...

I used to stay up all night back in high school making music on my soundblaster, mostly in ScreamTracker 3! I have a backup of them on a CD somewhere, but I don't want you guys to ROFLOL

-Tom

[garyb]

here is literally the greatest single piece of audio hardware ever made, and instead of people using it to make music and happiness that it works even THIS well, something that should be sufficient to sing it's praises, the company is nit-picked to death for what it can't do. well, that's great, you are right, but you are also the nail in the coffin.

thanks.

you know how many people have been upset enough about the lack of 64bit STS samplers to complain to SC, besides the few here? one. granted, he's a mover and shaker since he works for Timberlake, but the only big controversy is among those here.

it's not a great thing, but it's a minor issue. it's not like a Waves gold bundle that won't work in the latest version of Protools just because they want another $400. that $400 isn't even for an update other than compatibility with the new PT version.

yep, SC has some shortcomings.

people prefer cheap, disposable plugins for their toy computer music making pretend time. these people don't want or need Scope. SC can prioritize these folks, but at the cost of the Scope platform itself. Holger would certainly make more money, which could lead to big success. just port everything to VST format and sell, sell, sell. i'd care, but then i'm an audiophile...or SC can continue with Scope. it's a niche product for those who like such things. it'll never be mainstream, but on the other hand, it'll always be useful, unlike software that is designed to be replaced at regular intervals. people can have the world that they prefer, i suppose.

[dante]

I'm calling Troll on anyone playing on the STS beat-up - based on this :

Go to forum search : keyword STS and forum MUSIC

Well there's one hit for 2015 from NeilB, one for last year by Yish313' two by me and Ricardo 2014. Then you have to go back to 2009, 2008 etc etc. Apart from that I know Bud has a big STS collection.

So - where are all the STS music makers who now can't make music - or indeed ever used STS at all ?.

[Bud Weiser]

Go to forum search : keyword STS and forum MUSIC

Well there's one hit for 2015 from NeilB, one for last year by Yish313' two by me and Ricardo 2014. Then you have to go back to 2009, 2008 etc etc. Apart from that I know Bud has a big STS collection.

I never started a STS thread here, just only replied by the following reasons:

a)
I absolutely don´t understand why someone needs a 64Bit system for SCOPE.

b)
I like everything small footprint in software, thus the AKAI sample library as well as some EMU II / III & EoS.
In addition, STS samples and does not only play back samples.

To my knowledge and up to now, the are only 2 DAW apps urgently requiring 64Bit OS.

Phead Reason 8.1 and higher for PC & MAC.

Logic X for MAC only is the other one.

Anyone not using these apps and large NI-Kontakt samplelibraries can stay w/ 32bit in the audio world because all the other DAW apps are avaialble in 32Bit versions, some also cross platform.

You won´t get more audible gain or headroom from 64Bits as well as no better sonic quality/sound.

STS is in the SC SCOPE package because it is able to use the 90s sample library studio standard,- AKAI S3000 format.
It´s still good and I have amazing AKAI-CD content.
And since E.M.X.P. supports EII, Emax I & II, EIII and EoS as well as Oberheim DPX-1, Prophet 2000 and AKAI S sampler format and batch-converts all to SF2, w/ some time investment the result will be a great library for STS in the end and because the filters are so good in STS it will sound better than it sounded from the hardware original.

Now tell me it´s not worth to keep STS and trade it in for Kontakt, when in Kontakt these sample conversions all sound mediocre compared to the hardware.

Kontakt, Mach5 and others are good, but you get a completely different factory sample set with these and have to spend endless $$$$ to get new and more multigigabyte soundware which you better not use when fast load times are required.
And when you want changing that, you have to invest in ultra-fast SSD technology which is all about speed but not really reliable.
It never ends ...

Better think about WHICH sampled instrument really needs long and unlooped samples and which not.
Consider the really necessary sample rate too.
There are not too many instruments needing the full potential to be musically usefull.

My Kurzweil has finest string and orchestral stuff squeezed into 64MB ROM chips which sound amazing.

why bigger isn´t better ...
http://www.williamcoakley.com/articles. ... bigger.php

This 64Bit talk is really a joke and I wonder how music was been made when Kontakt didn´t exist.
It seems to be, computer, lots of RAM, sampled instruments, Kontakt and 64Bit OS is essential to make and to produce music at all and all other products not supporting these are non-professional nonsense and musically useless.

In fact NONE of all these products are necessary to make and to produce music, not 64Bit OS or a computer at all and also not Kontakt and not even any single sample.

Frank Zappa nailed it ... "shut up and play yer guitar"

Bud