Mastering - Too Quiet...

Tony B · Post by **Tony B** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 8:21 pm

Two Luna 11, Logic, Wavelab, Behringer Mixer, Audio Technica Mic, Rode NT1 mic, Zoom MRS 1044 nothing more. Where I am there are pro studios but yet still they want to know how I manage to get my signals so clean and loud. My recordings plays regularly on the radio stations. Once you get a good clean signal into the system that's it. The right distance, mic placements, correct volume levels and good ears are what matters. These Creamware cards are Great. Remember when compressing anything in the mix would be compressed also. A dog can hear frequencies that humans can't.

onomat · Post by **onomat** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 12:33 pm

In my opinion, to improve your home mastering:

1.Make your mixdowns @ 24 bit 44.1Khz...and master in 24bit.
1.1 listen to your favourite cds to get inspiration and a reference sound...

2.Use the spectrum analyser function in Steinberg Wavelab 4.0 or Spectra-lab also do a great analyser, to see what your favourite track is doing frequency wize and what you are doing to your mix...everything starts to sound beter with EQ until you bypass what you have done and realize the original was better...

3.use a good EQ, (sonalksis EQ, Waves, De-Vice'..(sorry, had to plug it!) and bypass often to hear the original

4. listen at low and high volume levels, in your car, in mono, headphones, pc speakers, in the other room...

5. don't work for more than 1 hour in one sitting, have regular ear breaks, never mix and master on the same day!

6.try to get your mix frequency range as flat as possible so all frequencies are represented equally and don't overcompress the natural dynamics of the music and voice (if you don't want to) why have all that high resolution 24bit etc..if you are going to reduce the dynamics in the end again anyhow???MAkes no sense.

7.use waves L2 ultramaximiser with an attenuation of about 6-12dB rather than an overall mix compressor(to get a hot master) and dither down to 44.1 16bit with the UV22 mastering plug-in by Apogee and finally...

8.after all that if you still don't like the result hand your work over to the pro who mastered your favourite commercial CD and pay the price...

goodluck, good mastering takes a lifetime to ....ahmmm...Master...
sayton
De-Vice'

Immanuel · Post by **Immanuel** » Sat Apr 17, 2004 3:21 pm

On 2004-04-16 13:33, onomat wrote:
6.try to get your mix frequency range as flat as possible so all frequencies are represented equally and don't overcompress the natural dynamics of the music and voice (if you don't want to) why have all that high resolution 24bit etc..if you are going to reduce the dynamics in the end again anyhow???MAkes no sense.

I read this as a misunderstanding. Why should the fact, that the music goes 24bit -> 16bit later make you not want to compress? The ekstra bits are "smaller" bits. I am against overcompressing - but that has nothing to do with chaning the word length.

ksamus · Post by **ksamus** » Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:38 am

To have loud , "fat" masters use good analog compressor (avalon vt 747, summit Audio , Manley) and Waves L2 for maximizing levels. Unfortunetelly This stuff is not cheap.

spiderman · Post by **spiderman** » Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:17 am

if you want a hot master then you have to think about it at the mix ! at the mastering it's too late . good or bad tools cheap or expensive tools. but you can do a zero dynamic mastering as a lot of people do ...

King of Snake · Post by **King of Snake** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:43 am

of course there are so many things to mastering that you should really let it be done by a professional. But hey, we can't all afford that (I know I can't) nor are we all in need of professional mastering when we can experiment at home!

I'd say the main difference between your own (too quiet) master and a commercial master is multiband compression. A multiband compressor can give you quite a boost in overall energy by compressing the individual frequency bands (to avoid them interfering with eachother).
The way I do it myself is to record a 24 bit master with Vinco on the master insert, 2:1 RMS compression, just 1-3 dB reduction, so very light. Then I use the VST "Endorphin" dualband compressor, again quite light settings. This doesn't give me quite as much volume as a commercial recording but it get's the job done.

Just remember that all those ultra "hot" recordings these days aren't neccesarily a good thing! It has been called the "loudness race" by mastering engineers and it basically means that cd's seem to get louder and louder all the time, just because everyone want to be the loudest! Of course the peak volume has stayed the same over the years, so what we've lost is dynamics. What we get in return is overly loud and tiring "wall of sound". Even though the human ear initially perceives "louder" as "better" it isn't very pleasant to listen to constant loudness. (the "loudness" button on your hifi should be covered with a sign reading "danger! do not press!"

) Remember when you're compressing to set the output levels the same as the non-comressed level! Otherwise you're just perceiving it to be better because it's louder, and not actually listening to what the compression effect is doing to your dynamics!
Remember there is a volume knob on everyone's amplifier and hifi system. You don't have to compress everything to death to make it loud, you can just turn this big knob on your hifi! Instant magic!!

so in the end, when you discover your mix isn't as hot as the commercial cd your using for comparison, give yourself a pat on the back for having done your duty in fighting the loudness race and saving a bit of dynamics!

[ This Message was edited by: King of Snake on 2004-06-28 09:45 ]

[ This Message was edited by: King of Snake on 2004-06-28 09:47 ]

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 10:54 am

ds-sound wrote:

If I'll lower it any more, It'll squash the sound to death.

This is exactly how Rush's last studio album ('Vapour Trails') was mastered. The waveform virtually ended up as a square wave...all the dynamics and transients crushed to death

Any suggestion how to gain extra energy without crapping up the mix?

I think there's been some good ideas already - lose any sub frequencies that you don't need as they use up a lot of headroom. Limit the transients and then compress to get the best dynamics-to-volume compromise. It sounds like you're already very happy with your EQ-ing, but making sure no frequency 'area' is too crowded (esp. the lows) will also gain you extra headroom.

After that, it's a question of how crushed you're prepared to make it!

As a sort-of analogy...imagine you're watching "Super Death Metal Slayer Live!!" on your telly - full Marshall stack, axes at the ready, double bass-drums...then a commercial break for margerine comes on and it BLOWS THE ROCK GROUP OUT OF THE WATER!!

(Now that's compression for ya!)

Royston

spiderman · Post by **spiderman** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 10:41 am

it is why you have to think about that at the mix .
by removing the low end of each track with a low cut save a LOT of headroom so the track can be set at a higher level . it better to compress each tracks than the whole mix . better to use peaklimiter than compresser .
it's independant of the equipment. stop to think that you need the 4000$ compresser.
the stupidity is not to have a hot mix . but it's to do a hot mastering from a dynamic mix . it destroy completly the job of the mixer ingeneer .

Me$$iah · Post by **Me$$iah** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:20 pm

My best mastering tip is simple

Izotope Ozone 3 VST

Best VST ive played with

Post by **hubird** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 6:47 pm

I just put the Optimaster plus Psy-Q on the multi track mix, record it, and postmaster it with PSP VintageWarmer, preset 'Mix light (or medium) driven tape', with some VW eq-ing if needed.
Sounds great and natural

symbiote · Post by **symbiote** » Wed Jul 06, 2005 6:26 am

My mastering chain is D-Comp -> PEQ4 -> Optimaster. I used to run the result into Ultramaximizer afterwards, but after learning to use Optimaster properly, I barely gained .5 dB. So I just ditched Ultramaximizer and added a few tenths of dB of gain in Optimaster. Sounds like a bomb.

And altho I agree the loudness wars have become completely silly, compression on the final mix really doesn't have to be overdone, nor automatically destroys a nice dynamic mix.

wayne · Post by **wayne** » Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:40 am

On 2005-07-05 18:20, Me$$iah wrote:
My best mastering tip is simple

Izotope Ozone 3 VST

Best VST ive played with

- hell of a one-year bump, Me$$iah

Izotope's cool, but it ain't Optimaster -> PsyQ

Post by **hubird** » Wed Jul 06, 2005 6:21 pm

my words

Me$$iah · Post by **Me$$iah** » Wed Jul 06, 2005 7:41 pm

Hey ,
Yeh I know a real old thread, but its like a real new thread to me.lol.

Im new to this forum, Im new to the creamware cards. So Im reading everything here, I might even bump an older topic without realising it. I just might read somthing and have to comment.heeheh

I aint tried the OptiMaster but i stand by Ozone .... it really is good

cheers
-Me$$iah

edited for spelling ...damn spelling

[ This Message was edited by: Me$$iah on 2005-07-06 20:43 ]

Grok · Post by **Grok** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 5:23 pm

On 2003-01-09 17:31, ds-sound wrote:
(...)
Any suggestion how to gain extra energy without crapping up the mix?

Thanks,
ds-sound
(...)

Balancing the mix frequencies: Har-Bal; this absolutely unique soft is an absolute must. It can greatly help to educate the hears. Only 81,75€
A such technical value for a such little money is simply incredible. This soft has strictly no competitor, even for 1 million $...

More level: limit the peaks...
Voxengo Elephant; Voxengo's products are outstanding and they are cheap. Elephant is one of the best limiter, if not the best one (I haven't tried the Waves L3 yet, but Elephant is better than the Waves L2 & L1, concerning transparency, and Elephant is much cheaper).

...Work with 32 bit float mixes and files (24 bit is good, 32 bit float is better); apply the best available dithering as the last step before converting to 16 bit...

[ This Message was edited by: Grok on 2005-08-02 21:51 ]