Scope 6 does not exist

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JoPo
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by JoPo »

auntybiotic wrote:I am sure if more potential customers knew just how cool SC stuff is (and knowing it exists would be a good start)
Just as simple as that.. I'm convinced too.

-->Tom-->If I understand well, you are you using XTC mode ? I think it's far from the best way to use Scope. I guess you know Scope project mode ? Ok, it's a bit more complicated but that complication allows you to do so much more things ! And first : routing !

The way I use Scope with a daw : my starting project has 24 stereo asio (but you can have 32 !), so I get back into Scope all daw instruments outputs & audio tracks then mix them into Scope with all Scope plugins. In that way, you can use any vst plugins before to send the audio data into Scope via an asio output. You can even resend it into your daw via an asio input, to process the sound with vst's then get back into Scope ! Dante did an issue about that at http://www.hitfoundry.com , somewhere...

In that way, Scope becomes the core of your system and your daw produce audio data, just like any instrument or singer... And it allows you to have many more audio processing/mixing/tweaking potential.

How do you mix hardware synth in XTC mode ? Do you have analog inputs with 0 latency going into a mixer with Scope plugins for outside devices (microphones, hardware synth, electric guitar) ? I used XIC mode one time 15 years ago and realized the lack of potential by comparison with Scope project environment ; so, I don't know how it works with analog inputs !...
> > > > > > > > > > > > --- Musica --> here ! ---< < < < < < < < < < < <
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

Hi,

No, I want XTC mode... but I got 64 bit so it doesn't work. Right now I have Scope devices going through ASIO into Sonar. Yes, there's about 3ms of delay. But you won't be able to tell. Hardware? Z-Link or ADAT into Scope then into Sonar. Yes, there's a delay, but I cannot hear it. Back 20 years ago we were happy with 20ms of delay and the instruments were playable. 3ms of delay is nothing. The AD takes at least 1.5ms just to capture the signal! I know that if you use Scope in real time, the delay is almost nothing. But it doesn't matter to me if I have a small delay. I don't really care if the XTC mode never works again. I'll just use the synths through ASIO. I grew up on Cakewalk and want to use that to do most of the work. I don't need Scope to mix. I am doing this just for fun! Come on, even MIDI has a delay, it's old technology.

Cheers,

-Tom
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

ehasting wrote:One of the biggest thing the apollo introduced was a way of using the UAD plugs in realtime..
however this workflow actually takes you out from the daw (and people love it).. and today i am using scope the same way as the apollo (more or less - if we ignore the fact that i am running moduar, and freely route whatever i want to one of the 20 analouge outputs).

synth -> A/D converter -> scope mixer (inserts..) -> Direct out -> asio -> yay baby DAW!

To be honest.. TC powercore did this "correct" workflow thingy (vst integrated plugins).. still they are more dead then my carpet in my living room.

Not sure if any workflow change would change the sales number of SCOPE.. however getting some "proper" lable name and graphics on the plugins blended with some cynical marketing could do some magic. SCOPE where early out with bx, spl and softube.. however it was probably too early. Its amazing how close a plugin sounds as soon as the plugin looks like a vintage hardware box!
Well, I'm trying to use the SDK, but no one on this forum knows anything! I just looked at all the available modules, and it won't be possible to implement what I want to using the stock DSP modules. How does S|C support/help developers? Who do I talk to? I don't mind writing a few assembler lines just to implement something the way I want to. It's not rocket science. I leave that one up the the Russians. Yes, Nasa uses Russian rockets cause they're cheap and reliable.

-Tom
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by dawman »

NASA is temporarily a hang out for climate scientists searching for a way to regulate Earths tempurature and organize launchpad protests.

Meanwhile former scientists from NASA work on new propulsion engines in the private sector that are better than a bureaucratic approach.
Pretty exciting stuff really still in the experimental stage.

So funding international efforts and paying Russia helps them out while old fashioned private sector competition moves forward.

Personally I just pay SDK guys for specialty devices.
Modular is the juice for Scope.
We already have everything we could ever need.

My favorite lately is having multiple mixers and insert fx.
One for FOH.
One for stage monitor.
One for seperate IEM mixing.

There so many advantages having Scope in a powerful 1U.
See no reason for a Scope 6.
But would be glad to have a reason to help fund a product that has paid for itself almost 72 times since 5/2009.
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

A 6000 dollar box has paid itself over almost 100 times? Christ!

That's a good investment!

-Tom
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dante
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by dante »

I've remixed almost 100 songs with the $2500 box version this year :)
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

100 songs! Christ! :D

I have so much going on right now, I cannot even get anything done. Need to stay focused. I don't think I'm gonna get any work done today. But it's a Sunday, so I don't care :lol:

I'm trying to make the VL Wizard work with my EX5, but something weird is happening. This did not happen before! Some kind of annoying feedback/digital distortion happening when I press a key on my keyboard going into Scope MIDI. Doesn't seem to happen with other synths. Hmm. I hope my cards are not dying :o

-Tom
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garyb
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by garyb »

tlaskows wrote:Gary,

You said at least once that you know a guy who knows a guy that can make a perfect mix with stock Cubase 4 plugins. Well, Sonar has some stock plugins. Not all of them are that good, but there are some decent ones. I hate to say this, because this has beaten to death, but if Scope doesn't integrate with people's workflow, it may just not sell all that well. BTW, Scope works great for the way I use it, no complaints. My UAD-2 (that is worthless right now) works great with Sonar, but I don't need 20 different compressors and 20 different EQs. But I have a lot of coin invested in native, so I'm really trying to steer away from being tied down to DSP.

-Tom
well, then f**k all.

keep chopping off your legs for convenience. nobody has a LOT of money in native. that's not a lot of money, audio-wise. if you don't care about audio the most, even if it's amateur work, then maybe you care about computers and playing with them more than audio work.

use things the way that you are happiest.
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dante
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by dante »

tlaskows wrote:Gary, You said at least once that you know a guy who knows a guy that can make a perfect mix with stock Cubase 4 plugins. Well, Sonar has some stock plugins. Not all of them are that good, but there are some decent ones. I hate to say this, because this has beaten to death, but if Scope doesn't integrate with people's workflow, it may just not sell all that well. BTW, Scope works great for the way I use it, no complaints. My UAD-2 (that is worthless right now) works great with Sonar, but I don't need 20 different compressors and 20 different EQs. But I have a lot of coin invested in native, so I'm really trying to steer away from being tied down to DSP. -Tom
You only need 2 stock plugins to make a great mix - 1 stock eq and 1 stock comp ! Check out this guys blog http://therecordingrevolution.com/tag/graham-cochrane/

Also, you have the option to do what I do - all your mixing in DAW (Sonar in your case, Reason in my case) retaining your investment in VST, then feed the final stereo mix to Scope for mastering / finalising - whatever you want to call it - and possibly add Scope Synths. I have a stock mastering Scope project which also has Zarg ProWave in it, then use PCI for proTones. Getting rid of all that ASIO transfer was the best thing I ever did performance wise (since now I can operate at 96Khz with ease @ less than 3ms latency) and the single mix surface workflow wise - and the end result still has the great Scope sound due the mastering plugs. They make everything sound good.

So you get :
1) Convenience (mix one surface)
2) Cheap (no need buy more plugins)
3) Great sound (@96KHz)
4) Performance (if you got a decent system, run as many native eq and comp as you need on a CPU that ASIO was chewing up before).
5) No need for UAD2 - at one time I used to actually consider adding UAD2 before discovering above setup. Now it would be a total waste of $$

All with NO compromise !
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

Thanks for the advice Mr. Dante. I see what you're saying. So I should just bounce the final mix then send it through Scope to make it sound the best? That sounds reasonable, I don't mind doing that. But it works great the way I'm using it right now. But if you guys are saying it will sound better in Scope, I have to believe you because I am just a little youth :lol:

-Tom
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dante
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by dante »

I just route the final output from Scope via ASIO back to a Reason track, record it, normalise then bounce that to disk. Reason can bounce a 96khz track to desktop in like 2 seconds then I can upload that to Soundcloud.

So I haven't eliminated ASIO completely, just reduced it from like 32 tracks to max 8. Still enough to make a difference CPU wise.

It's all realtime, mastering chain active whilst mixing.
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

Cool cool :D

-Tom
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by auntybiotic »

I pretty much do what Dante does, with the addition that after levelling and panning in the daw, i also group instruments together in the DAW into separate busses allowing each group to be sent separately into it's own scope effects chain (eg drums group through a parallel compressor, lead vocals through eq / compressor, bass through eq / compressor, etc etc). I then record the output of each chain back into my daw as a separate stereo wav for each group.

I then route these 'grouped' stereo wavs through an external mixing desk for final balancing, fader riding & adding any analogue eq colour, etc...

The desks master bus is then routed back into scope, through my scope 'mastering chain' which is then recorded back into the daw as the 'mastered' wav (BUT you can also just route the groups back into the DAW and record them separately again if preferred, then apply mastering via scope chain after this).

I find doing it this way retains the benefits of using the amazing scope effects but without introducing any fx / monitoring latency which can sometimes occur when using the scope effects 'real time' whilst mixing in the daw (routing into scope from the daw and back into the daw again, monitoring in the daw).

I do know of course that I could avoid any latency by simply mixing in scope.....but as i like the benefits of the daw environment AND the scope environment AND the analogue mixer environment, this is the simplest approach for me.

In fact it is the ability to do this that has kept me faithful to scope - NOTHING touches it's routing...
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

Yes, there's is nothing out there with Scope's routing capability, even after almost 20 years! I mean you can connect almost anything to anything! It's out of this world...

-Tom
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ronnie
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by ronnie »

Ditto on dante and JoPo here.
"I’ve come to the conclusion that synths are like potatoes, they’re no good raw—you’ve got to cook ‘em, and I cooked these sounds for months before I got them to the point where they sounded musical to me." Lyle Mays
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

Ronnie,

why doesn't your subwoofer go down to 20Hz? I have a cheap M-Audio 10" and it goes down low. I can't use it because my parents were complaining :(

-Tom
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dante
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by dante »

Because he didn't get the gig on earthquake disaster movie soundtracks ? :lol:
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ronnie
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by ronnie »

Who sez my sub-woofer don't go down to 20Hz? I just shave it off around 30 Hz so my balls stay in phase.
"I’ve come to the conclusion that synths are like potatoes, they’re no good raw—you’ve got to cook ‘em, and I cooked these sounds for months before I got them to the point where they sounded musical to me." Lyle Mays
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tlaskows
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by tlaskows »

AHAHAHAHA that's a good one :lol:

-Tom
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dante
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Re: Scope 6 does not exist

Post by dante »

NASA have one agenda. Run to Mars when earth fucks up. Well, someone tell me a better agenda ? Apart from being able to take XITE along for the ride.

has anyone envisaged what it would be like, weightless in space with a laptop and XITE floating next to you ?
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