Is there any such Motherboard that ....

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garyb
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:43 pm

actually, the jury is TOTALLY out as to whether Z270 works or not.

Jim tried two motherboards that worked well with Bidule.
another motherboard has not worked well with Cubase.

that is not enough evidence to make a definitive statement, yet.

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Sounddesigner
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by Sounddesigner » Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:23 pm

Kaby Lake X has just been released. It is i7 7740X on the new Socket LGA 2066. It is a Quad-Core running at 4.3GHZ with 8 MB L3 Cache and costs only $349. This X version quad is on a different Socket than the non-X and definitely is worth investigating as well.
The i9 7900X 10-Core seems to be out to.

Kaby Lake X - https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductL ... isNodeId=1


One of the DAW builders on GS has the i9 10-Core - https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-c ... audio.html


PS. Both the new Quad and the new 10 Core are on the same 2066 Socket. It is surprising to see the new 7740X Quad-Core be put on the Socket 2066 .



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Sounddesigner
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by Sounddesigner » Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:34 pm

There is a huge range of processors released for this new Socket 2066, i.e. multiple Quads, a 6-core, 8-core, and 10-core. This move by Intel is strange and out of the norm but great IMO, especially for SCOPERs possibly. Strange and out of the norm because intel has deviated from their usually policy and model because they've included lower-end Quads on this Socket with higher-end 6/8/10 Cores; also it's not just i7 Quads that are X-versions on this Socket but also the REALLY low-end i5 Quads are on this LGA Socket 2066. These lower-end Quads being on this Socket essentially may make Socket 2066 a great solution for a much larger number of SCOPE users if it is compatible because of all the different multi-core options 4/6/8/10 and platform types i5/i7. The Quad options for Socket 2066 definitely caught me by surprise. It's great to have another Socket to try out for SCOPE XITE and it's great these X-versions on this new Socket have a wide range of options that go from lower-high-end to super-high-end.

Another deviation from the norn Intel did for this new X-series Socket 2066 is by making the 8-core faster than the 6-core. Usually the more cores they add the less speed you get but this time the 8-core is running faster at 3.6GHZ and the 6-core is running at lesser speed of 3.5GHZ (the 8-core also has significantly more L3 Cache than the 6-core). The 10-core of this X-series does drop in speed tho at only 3.3GHZ. The Quad still looks like the winner for me at 4.3GHZ.

Some of the Motherboards for this new Socket are VERY expensive (like $500), but some are reasonably priced (around $200). Building a desktop computer system with these X-series processors is going to be more expensive with its components cpu/RAM/Motherboard than non-X-versions such as those on Socket 1151. Altho the X-version systems will be more expensive it may only be a little bit more costly if you buy the right brand-names and models. Years ago the X-version of a Quad costed like $999 now the i7 7740X only cost about $20 more than the non-x 7700k. You can easily build a system with some of these X processors for under $1300.

CyberpowerPC will custom build for around $1300 or less and they have all of the new X-series processors 4/6/8/10 cores in stock - https://www.cyberpowerpc.com/category/g ... aming-pcs/

It's a good chance i'll take a gamble and try out this new Socket 2066 this fall with the i7 7740X Quad. I'm farly certain if you buy the lower quad on this Socket 2066 that you can later upgrade to the 8-core on the same Socket easily using all the same components you already had for the Quad with the Octo i.e. Motherboard/RAM/etc .

For those living in the USA and wish to play it safe and not gamble on the new Socket 2066 MagicMicro is still building custome i7 4790K's systems on Ebay. They have a lot of listings there for the custome i7 4790k's systems. My eye is on this as well if I decide not to gamble with Socket 2066 X-Quad.

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Bud Weiser
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by Bud Weiser » Fri Jun 30, 2017 5:08 am

IMO, it makes not much sense discussing socket 2066 before someone pulls the trigger, does a DAW build w/ SCOPE/XITE in mind and does "in depth" tests w/ DSP hungry devices consuming lots of SAT connections and full count (64 ?) of ASIO channels and other I/Os like ADAT and WAVE being active.
It doesn´t matter how many and which processors are available for that socket before someone w/ SCOPE skills and DAW building experience is able to confirm 100%+ functionality of X299 chipset and some manufacturer´s mobo designs.

When I read z270 works, I had great hope X299 will work too, but now and since we know z270 doesn´t work 100%, I fear it will be the same w/ x299 ´cause x99 didn´t work also.
There was some relation between z170 and x99 and there will be also some between z270 and x299.

Would be great when I´m wrong though !

:)

Bud
CFD,- the studio standard :wink:

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Sounddesigner
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by Sounddesigner » Fri Jun 30, 2017 2:45 pm

Bud Weiser wrote:IMO, it makes not much sense discussing socket 2066 before someone pulls the trigger, does a DAW build w/ SCOPE/XITE in mind and does "in depth" tests w/ DSP hungry devices consuming lots of SAT connections and full count (64 ?) of ASIO channels and other I/Os like ADAT and WAVE being active.
It doesn´t matter how many and which processors are available for that socket before someone w/ SCOPE skills and DAW building experience is able to confirm 100%+ functionality of X299 chipset and some manufacturer´s mobo designs.
Bud I disagree here. People can't "pull the trigger and test the new Socket first" before being made aware that the new Socket 2066 even exists, so some discussion on it prior to testing it can be a good thing :) . I simply was making people aware that there is another Socket to consider wich is the first step before pulling the trigger and testing with XITE as you state and before giving a review. One has to be aware of the new Sockets existence first before anything else :) . I was simply making people aware of the new Socket and what it offers not stating how good it is with XITE or for them, or trying to substitute such trial-and-error with my post.

For me personally the new Socket would have not caught my attention until I was aware that a Quad was available for it. Sure,there isn't much to talk about until the new Socket 2066 has been tested, I would agree with that, but people first need to be made aware of the new Socket and what all it offers BEFORE buying and testing. I was simply informing those who are unaware of the new release what's now available.



Bud Weiser wrote: When I read z270 works, I had great hope X299 will work too, but now and since we know z270 doesn´t work 100%, I fear it will be the same w/ x299 ´cause x99 didn´t work also.
There was some relation between z170 and x99 and there will be also some between z270 and x299.

Would be great when I´m wrong though !

:)

Bud
I agree largely with you, when I read Z270 was working with XITE-1 I was VERY happy and excited with that news and very disappointed later as more results came in. BUT like Gary and I stated earlier there still may be Motherboards that work for Socket 1151, so to quote Gary "the jury is still out on it" and more evidence is needed before we can make a call on its viability. So I wouldn't label Z270, X99, etc as unusable platforms yet, BUT it definitely doesn't look good for SCOPE XITE users with those chipsets and Sockets so far.

I definitely understand your skepticism for the new X299 platform since X99 and Z270 has been problematic so far, I'm a little afraid to try the new Socket/chipset myself :) . We are definitely in some sort of mine-field :D . But it is possible for X299 to be just fine with SCOPE while at the same time the other older chipsets z270/x99 not work properly. We'll need to test it for sure. So far it hasn't been going well for us SCOPERS with current Sockets such as 1151 so some skepticism, worry, frustration is definitely reasonable and valid, and like I said I myself am afraid to even try the newest Socket 2066 even tho I may still 'bite the bullet' and do so this fall - BUT I don't think it's the end of the world for SCOPE and from my experience with SCOPE related problems some sort of solution eventually does come.

I definitely share your concern with these new Sockets 1151, 2066, etc and XITE-1 but I do believe we'll figure out something eventually. This current situation may hurt SonicCore with new customers but us older ones will find something that works ultimately.

I will take my chances with 2066 before 1151 if I decide to gamble.

One of our biggest problems is that we are a small platform thus there is not a lot of people testing all the many different motherboards for z270/x99/etc .


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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by dante » Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:58 pm

If 1151 wont work, then is it the case we miss out on Coffee lake i7 - 6 core (RRP $349) for XITE ?
coffee-lake.jpg
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pic from https://www.pcgamesn.com/intel/intel-14 ... lease-date

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garyb
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:26 pm

maybe, or maybe there will be other changes.
it's hard to say at this point.

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frokka
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by frokka » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:09 am

How about an external solution for the PCI cards, has anyone tried this yet?

Like the PCI cage from Startech here:
https://www.startech.com/Cards-Adapters ... y~PEX2PCI4

If the motherboard chipset supports native PCI, then the PCI-express slot also supports it?

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:27 am

those work in a limited fashion. the external pci boxes are not really a solution.

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frokka
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by frokka » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:33 am

How limited?

A lower threshold for PCI overflow?

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garyb
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:03 pm

yep, and the power supplies for those expansion boxes are rarely powerful enough to support more than one card. only the Magma boxes really work well and it's at the expense of PCI performance.

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by frokka » Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:57 am

garyb wrote:Z270 works, so far.
Was this in reference to XITE, old PCI or both?

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:54 am

the user who tried Z270 tried it with the XITE, but as of now, it is not certain that Z270 is good.

socket 1150 is the latest configuration that is proven.

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by dawman » Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:48 pm

I took no chances and have 2 x spare i7 4790k PCs and spare parts for a 4th.

I'm losing out on Windows 10, and all future designs.
But I don't like the fucking future, it's more planned obsolescence and uncertainty of drivers working.
I'd suggest getting an RME then use a Scope DAWs digital/analog outs to connect to your new extra core CPU.

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by frokka » Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:55 am

Sounddesigner wrote: Z270 only works if you only need a small number of Asio channels, so no Z270 is not as good as 4790k since 4790k allows for a lot of Asio channels to be used. I'm only reporting others experience since I've never used either processor but from what I've gathered you can basically get full functionality of SCOPE with 4790k but SCOPE is VERY limited with every Motherboard tested that's on Socket 1151. This does NOT mean all the Motherboards out there for Socket 1151 are bad/limited nor does it mean the next-generation of CPU's for Socket 1151 will have the same problems but ATM things don't look good and all the recent user experiences are a bad sign. It does'nt look good for SCOPE XITE-1/D on current Socket 1151 BUT we may get lucky and surprised with 7700k or next-gen Cannon Lake from eventually finding a fully working Motherboard on the Socket 1151.
Is it possible that some boards work well with ASIO1 rather than ASIO2?
- Or do you guys normally test both setups, eg. with different sequencers?

(Most sequencers use ASIO2, but Reaper works only with ASIO1.)

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garyb
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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:45 am

both have the same problem, but i've used Reaper with ASIO2 many times...

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by dawman » Fri Sep 22, 2017 2:24 pm

I tried a 7700k and the only enhancement I noticed was polyphony + script complexity in Kontakt could use 600 voices.
I get 540 on i7 4790k. So 10% seems accurate.
But NI always uses new instructions and has 3 recent upgrades.
So an i7 7700k helps with more streaming voices.

Pray for the AMD Zen + Vega in 2018.
Otherwise these latest Intels is a last gasp to rebrand and move Silicon.

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by Interference » Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:51 am

Hi guys,

Very interesting topic.

Another thing what about an "actual config" for 2 PCI cards:

Motherboard with 2 PCI?
Processor (even not the last one)?
Other possibilities with PCIe bridges? Gary you said it works fine is it easy to configure?


Thanks!

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by Interference » Mon Sep 25, 2017 1:01 am

+ @Gary I read you talked about using 2 computers, how does it work?

- Plug one PCI card in each computer and something like VST link?

Thanks!

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Re: Is there any such Motherboard that ....

Post by garyb » Mon Sep 25, 2017 10:13 am

...maybe, or have the sequencer in one computer and use ADAT to connect them. why do you need two computers?

there have been plenty of Z97 motherboards that have two PCI slots.

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