Brexit

[garyb]

actually, colonized country borders are artificial. normally, borders are a tribe or ethnic group's territory or are bounded by natural obstacles.

as i see it, most problems are local problems that should be fixed locally.
the problem with a strong overlord is that local issues are steamrolled by the desires of those in charge, who may have little to no understanding of people's real needs in an area, or may just be corrupt and wicked.

as i remember it, the EU was formed by forcing quite a few populations into the exact thing that they voted against. i notice that many countries ignored the popular vote when joining the EU and also are avoiding the vote when many want to leave the EU. i don't like to see Europe colonized by corporate interests any more than i like to see African or American or Asian ethnicities colonized.

i'm all for economic cooperation, but not at the expense of sovereignty. of course, as an American, i was raised with the idea of personal sovereignty, which really is something that many people around the world have never truly considered...

[Nestor]

Hubird always
I realize that any conversation with you it always ends up getting twisted. You always put words in people’s mouths. You are almos always rhetoric in your expression if you don't like what other say. You are always concerned about what others are reading and thinking from your “ego”, rather than trying to communicate ideas because you have actually something to say. It is always useless to explain you that what I have said, in a given point, it is not what you think I have said, even if I explain you three or four times the same with different words. Talking to you it is always an absolute waste of time. You have a twisted mind.

[Nestor]

Dismantling society, ending up prosperity, it is the best way to easily control the masses, evil yes, but effective. This is a program. Through the false media, they implant false paradigms in your mind, and most people believe their explanations because they don’t have the needed information and contrast to know about it. While you are busy with sports, the cinema, and your latest preferred TV show, they work to conquer your life in secret.

It is a worldwide issue! Sovereignty is disappearing, or at least, they are traying to get it from you, what can be worse than that? This is the dominion of the world government powers rising to the top. This is so rotten, that even the most important bankers, which are not allowed by law to speak up about politics, give their views publicly like if it was normal…, showing how far the power behind this moves have come to be, indeed, it is their dominion.

This is a way to pull us all into their net of globalized dominion yes. The most outrageous thing behind it is that they are taking from your hands the power to decide, and the very freedom of being a person, this pushes us into losing the control of our own sense of being humans. This is a way to spread dictatorship globally, while hating and ending democracy.

The EU have become a paradise for speculation, as many wolfs are really getting rich through the disgrace of others… It is disgusting! We are so far away from democracy, the only democracy that there exists today is the one explained in the books… If this is not true, how is it possible that the commissaries of the EU can have more power and even to come to overrule the decisions taken by the ELECTED parliament of Europe? One word: Tyranny, period! This looks more like the Soviet constitution than the European one I’m afraid.

What we are going to see, is the rise of unaccountable, unelected autocrats, idiots greedy of power and money, which will execute the orders of those going on with the world wide government strategy, like it happened in Greece, but multiplied by hundreds. This is what they are traying to do, don't they? We are living tragic times! I don’t swallow shit!

At least, there is resistance against tirany, and that makes me happy.

[siriusbliss]

No Constitution.
No elected representatives (just high-totalling 'commissioners')
10 nation-states economies faltering.
Iceland already out.
Ireland was discussing leaving and returning to the Punt currency 11 years ago.
ECB manipulating
Immigrants used as cannon-fodder.

What could possibly go wrong?

Others will probably follow.

[braincell]

The vast majority of young voters, immigrants and urban voters wanted to remain in the EU. Brextit was born out of racism and neophobia. It's a symptom of Future Shock. Some people can not adjust to living in the modern world.

[siriusbliss]

In the end personal sovereignty rules the day.

[dawman]

Brextit was born out of racism and neophobia.

Cool......

So when wealthy white Liberals are removed we call that racism...?

I remember listening to the results watching this gorgeous Irish Lass with bright red hair on Skye.
"Experts" were commenting and when Birmingham was being tallied the "Experts" were touting it twas a STAY vote since it was full of Asians and Arabs, 2nd and 3rd generation Brits.

Suddenly Birmingham was like 68% LEAVE and the "experts" fumbled through their papers wondering what went wrong.

Are these the racists you speak of..?

Actually I see the vote as a voice.

Media likes to claim racism naturally, but I think those who call others names from a paid for podium suck lots of dicks, but they sure are admired by the Sheep.

They should save some of that cock for me and quit being stingy...

As a brown skinned racist, I can relate to being enslaved by wealthy white Liberals.
I often enjoy taking free money from them and tripling it at a Casino.
It's great pretending to be a victim, they race to rescue you in hopes of a vote for the next bull shit election where we get to select a billionaire loudmouth or a fat wealthy Liberal criminal...

God Bless The USA......

[hubird]

I think 'right wing' USA should repack itself into a new movement of the reasonable and constructive parts of the lower- and middle class, and together with 'left' make coalition government possible (more parties).
As I have understood, the republicans have allowed themselves to be held hostage by Tea Party, to not miss the train.
The raw sabotage politics to which this led made the gap between the political elite and the people in the streets only deeper.

The result is Trump.

His tough anti-establishment performance might generate a few good feel moments for the o so angry people, but I'm afraid at the end of the game they will draw the shortest drive: Billary will win the elections, if you ask me.
Which is a shame indeed.

It had been nice if the US after the presidency of Obama, who wasn't breed by the elite but by his parents, again had chosen someone who also can't be said to be part of 'the elite', Bernie Sanders.

Billary is totally elite, but won't do stupid things to show off, especially internationally.
Trump however is pure dynamite, with machiavellist Putin looking for area expansion at the Baltic Sea and east Ukraine
Interesting times

(small edits, like always ).

[garyb]

Hilary and Barack are cousins.

[Sounddesigner]

Great post Sounddesigner

Well, it's clear that you attribute all today's problems to socialism, instead of, for example, globalisation, too much failstates around, a growing distance between the political and cultural elite and the masses, etc.

Your statement requires too long of a answer but I'm willing to take the time this time.

Globalization, Globalwarming, Sociolism, multi-culturalism, political-correctness, unfettered-immigration, bogus wars, etc are all interdependent/intercorrelated tools that are conducive to each other and each used to achieve the same end-results. These things create problems that government use as excuses to take more of your rights. Most of our problems are self-inflicted and artificial. Government creates the problem and then comes with a bogus solution and tells you you need this solution. For examples:

1. Immigration: we are told here in the USA that illegal immigration and legal-immigration are needed because we are becoming 'heavy at the top' meaning our birth-rate is too low thus we are starting to have a too large of a older population. This is true but this is also a Government created problem since it was government that legalized unfettered abortions amongs otherthings. Since 1973 there has been over 50 million babies aborted wich is staggeringly more than 1/8th of our population of 320 million. We in turn have taken the future of this country further away from our children and replaced our children with foreigners. Is'nt a parents job too make the country a better place for their children? Government created the problem then creates a bogus solution.

Illegal immigration is also costly because schooling, medical, welfare programs, etc are needed to support the illegals and those things cost taxpayers plus illegal immigration drives down job wages for legal Americans. If legal Americans can no longer find good paying jobs and are also paying for illegal Immigrant's schooling, imprisonment, etc then those legal Americans end up needing more social welfare programs (socialism) to survive themselves cause of low wage jobs and heavy taxes to cover social welfare programs for others. This is social-programs politicians create and use to get your vote once you need them due to artificial problem creation (Think Rome's "bread and circuses" for votes). Illegal immigration contributes to more poverty and more poverty to the need for social welfare programs wich creates greater 'National poverty/debt' wich ultimately leads to government taking more of your rights. Poverty and illegal immigration leads to more crime wich of course leads to stricter laws and more attacks on civil rights like the right to bare arms. As soon as terrorist attacks occur the politicians scream gun control but bad immigration policies are what let the terrorists in in the first place. Obamacare is also a attack on capitalism, religious rights, and gives government A LOT more size/power as well as force us the people to keep certain businesses in power (insurance companies), so government perpetuates some bogus aristocracy with Businesses at the peoples expense because Obamacare is viewed as needed due to artificial poverty that's been manufactured by their own policies. Most major terrorist acts on American soil since 911 have been done by immigrants, illegal immigrants, and children of immigrants/illegals. Once terror attacks occur we the people loose more rights; The Patriot Act passed by congress took a lot of rights and because government isn't suppose to force you to buy certain commerce obamacare took rights as well in that regard. They claim obamacare is needed for the poor but poverty is being artificially manufactured.

2. Bogus Wars: Mass Immigration, poverty, lose of civilian rights, etc are all created threw bogus wars as well. A bogus war in Iraq and toppling dictators policy for other Middle East nations as well e.g. Syria, Libya, etc lead to the creation of Isis and the refugee problem that Europes people and the American citizens now have to deal with. The bogus war and toppling dictators policies are all done by Government and the problems the policies create such as more poverty and more crime are suffered by the native citizens then Government comes with bogus solutions such as more Socialism. Mass refugee intakes contribute to poverty amongs the Native citizens and leads to more social-welfare-programs as well as rights being lost and ultimately your very country being took over by foreign people/culture. Government caused these problems and come with bogus solutions. These are self-inflicted artificial problems that are costly to the people.

3. Globalization in itself isn't necessarily bad but bad trade-deals and lack of incentives to keep companies in America is bad. As long as money is in politics bad trade deals will occur. As long as Globalization is done incorrectly poverty will increase and ultimately lack of Civil rights, more Government and more government-control, etc. There is a correlation with all these tools (globalization, socialism, immigration, etc).

4. The Great Recession that started here in the USA and spreaded all threw-out the world was created by bad Government policies and the people suffer the poverty created from it and then forced to bail-out big banks/corporations to keep them in power.

Part of what lead to the financial crash was policies by the Clinton liberals from the 1990's "The Community re-investment Act" - Also called the "nono bill" (no jobs no money yes loan). Threw social-welfare programs anyone could buy and own a house even if they truly could not afford it. When many people were later unable to pay for these houses it contributed to the financial collapse/Great Recession. Some believe this was a deliberate act to crash the economy but either way more Sociol-Welfare-programs/Socialism (more foodstamps, obamacare, etc) is seen as the answer to the Great Recession wich ironicly was largely causes by Sociol-welfare-programs.


Don't get too caught up in fancy terms just look at current results and end results. Britain leaving the EU is a end-result from bad policy results i.e. bad immigration, globalization, political-correctness, multi-culturalism, etc and all these lead to more socialism if you don't break-away like Britain. The problems here in American are intermediate-results a disasterous final-results is coming if we don't change.

Two remarks:
1. You consequently write sociolism instead of socialism.
Is that intentionaly?
Does it mean something?
2. Do you use the term socialism when you mean social democracy?
Because we in Europe by far don't have socialistic states.
Health care isn't socialism, it's just common sense.

I mis-spelled the word. I meant Socialism. Socialism has a broader definition than what you listed. It does not just mean 'Community owned' it also means that Government owns all industries and here in the USA it also means too many Sociol-welfare-programs and to a extent all definitions are the same. If most of your money goes to taxes wich largely covers social-welfare-programs such as free college for all, government-healthcare, foodstamps, etc then the community owns your paycheck. Government also grows bigger and more powerfull from social-welfare-programs. All definitions are the same ultimately and on some level.


As for your comment of Government-Healthcare being common-sense, well if the majority of the people don't want it then common-sense is to NOT have it since in order to be 'common-sense' you have to be 'common' . Here in America the people did not want Obamacare it was forced on us ultimately by the Supreme Court wich has been forcing many unconstitutional things on us. America has only had government-healthcare for a few years but we've existed for over 200 years and got by just fine without it. Obviously if America is the super-power of the world when looking at military and economic might before Obamacare then obviously we were doing something right or we wouldn't have become so powerfull. After every major war victory we've had a booming/thriving middleclass (from 1945-1973 after World War 2 and from 1991 -2000 after Cold-War victory) wich eliminates the need for government-healthcare. Create good job opportunities and cheaper Education and you eliminate the need for Government-healthcare. I'm not saying we shouldn't make corrections to the Healthcare system but Obamacare isn't addressing the root of the problem. The root of the problem is that Hospitals much like colleges OVERCHARGE. Drug companies here in the USA can charge you whatever price they want to and get away with it; Administative costs are exhorbitant as well since when you look at your doctor bill you may pay $20 for a $1 aspiran and $2 just for a gauz/wipe etc; and you pay for doctor's high insurance costs wich are brought about from frivolous law-suits and over-payment for legitamit suits at times. Obamacare is not 'common-sense' since it does not address the root of the healthcare problems wich is exhorbant doctor bills prices. Instead of lowering the cost of healthcare by addressing exhorbant charges Obamacare makes other people pay for the ever increasing high prices of Healthcare.

Government also promotes unhealthy living wich leads to the need for more hospital treatment such as recreational-drug legalization and free-love. And doctors abuse Government-healthcare by creating more hospital visits than necessary to keep charging the insurance card as well as doctors and drug-companies have over-prescribed things like opiods wich leads to the use of illegal drugs like heroin wich leads to more crime, more poverty, more tuffer laws, bigger government and ultimately more socialism.

I've read lately that it's remarkable that young Americans don't care anymore to be labled with 'social' or 'socialist' as a consequence of supporting Bernie Sanders.
They just want a more social America.
According to you they are mislead, and the elder know better.
But the tendency is there, 'social' isn't a dirty word anymore, and Sanders wasn't chanceless at all.
Second-next elections could be a break trough regarding this proces.
I know there's a difference between the country side and the cosmopolitical city regions, like everywhere in the world, but it's also true that the movement to the cities is a worldwide phenomenon.
The Republican party is said to be suffering from that effect.
Do you think all these developments won't change America?
The elder will die sooner anyway, so that doesn't help much.

Socialism still is a bad word to the older people in America. Many Americans died fighting against communism/socialism/etc in past wars. The youth are negatively influenced by the Liberals who have power on all fronts starting with being the professors at colleges and Universities then with owning most Media outlets then with the Supreme Court, etc. All these Liberal institutions teach that Socialism is OK. When the Supreme Court passes a big communist/socialist landmark fundamentally altering ruling the majority of the people hate it but overtime become acclamated to the new environment and the children raised in the new and more socialistic enviroment see nothing wrong with it simply cause it's all they've ever known. Also the Millennials wich largely followed Bernie Sanders have had a large part of their life-span experiencing the Great Recession and enormously high college fees and lack of good jobs once college is finished, so because times are tuffer for them they are more vulnerable and receptive to Socialism. They want all the social-welfare-programs they can get cause times are very hard for them amongs otherthings. It's called indoctrination and the politicians, media, court rulings, Professors, etc all indoctrinate. The elders in America who truly know better need to do what the elders in Britain did and I'm sure they will at some point.


EDITED

[siriusbliss]

Iceland did it right.
Tell the EU to go fuck off.
Kick out, arrest the corrupt bankers
Return to sovereign use of natural resources

Start a soccer team and beat the English

VERY symbolic statement (and awesome timing)

[garyb]

Obama care has been great for me.
first, i don't qualify for the discounts, so i am forced to purchase insurance for $350 a month and it's worse than i used to be able to get on my own, since almost every category of "care" has a $10,000 deductible. the upside of this is that i can go to a hospital in Thailand with a lower out of the pocket cost and better doctors for what a serious illness would cost with Obamacare. of course, i would be looking at this plan because it is the least expensive. naturally, i literally do NOT have an extra $350 a month on the chance that i might need a doctor. i may die, oh well...

the above would be ok, but...
the ridiculous price for less-than-basic care is mandatory, since it would be bad if everyone didn't ante up their portion for the fabulous savings that only insurance companies that have monopolies sponsored by the government can bring. actually, i would like catastrophic coverage only, but that's not acceptable to the federal government. i have to have it all with big deductibles because the president is worried for me otherwise, and also so that hospitals and doctor's professional groups don't go broke.

and that would be ok, but...
the IRS fines me at the end of the year for not having insurance and it's several thousand dollars that i already didn't have. and the IRS isn't even a government agency, it's an agency of the central, private bank, so i don't even know how that money goes to the fabulous "healthcare", which equates to a hell of a lot of prescriptions and not much health, that i can't afford... yes, you can get just about any pills you want for free. the "healthcare" system demands that you have a prescription for something.

wow, that's so great. insurance companies make the cost of seeing a doctor more expensive than ever and they have the backing of the federal government to make sure that i pay even if i don't get sick or i'm willing to stick it out until i die. yeah, that socialized medicine! it sure is a perfect example of a more social society.

really. the old medicare system was better. if you were indigent, you didn't pay. otherwise, you paid cash. at least if you were an idiot who didn't prepare for an emergency, you didn't get an extra penalty on your income tax, so you might be able to come up with some cash.

socialism and communism are great as long as the scope of organization is only local. on the national and especially international level they're just poison dictatorships with a smiley face.

[braincell]

You are comparing what you are paying now to what you paid years ago. It would have gone up without Obamacare.

[dawman]

Since when do commoners have an opinion on this.
We had doctors dealing with patients.

Then the ruling class decided a middleman should be involved.
Naturally the costs go up.

Now we have ruling class and insurance gangsters. 2 middlemen.
Only a mathematically deficient publicly educated person would conclude that costs would come down.


Besides this isnt important.

Youre not suppose to like it.
Youre suppose to buy it.

[garyb]

braincell-no, i'm saying that it sucks to be FORCED to buy insurance that i can't afford and then it sucks to be penalized MONEY for not buying what i can't afford. i have no insurance and i haven't had any my entire adult life. big brother can go die.

dawman-yep.

[siriusbliss]

Obamacare was a roundabout bailout of the insurance companies at the same time try were bailing out the banks.

It's a classic shim sham operation.

Too bad people haven't woken up to this obvious fact yet.

[dawman]

Never thought of that angle.
Tax payers were on the hook until several months ago when Stop Gap measures expired.

Explains why United left California.

Can't wait to see that beady eyed coked up MIT Professor fool the Sheep for the next group of pro American globalists.

Good to see you Siriusbliss....

[siriusbliss]

Never thought of that angle.

Good to see you Siriusbliss....

Good to see you Jimmy Solaris

G

[garyb]

actually, now that I've had a better look at the whole "Brexit" thing(what a dumb name meant for 30 second soundbites), I really don't think any of this drama means all that much. chances are that little will change, there may be a special status for GB(like with the money), but the Economic ties won't be cut so easily. on top of that, the vote isn't even considered to be legally binding. I'm sure that there's much more under the surface than what I'm seeing, but I'm not convinced that the vote will even matter, except for the panic that it causes.

[siriusbliss]

actually, now that I've had a better look at the whole "Brexit" thing(what a dumb name meant for 30 second soundbites), I really don't think any of this drama means all that much. chances are that little will change, there may be a special status for GB(like with the money), but the Economic ties won't be cut so easily. on top of that, the vote isn't even considered to be legally binding. I'm sure that there's much more under the surface than what I'm seeing, but I'm not convinced that the vote will even matter, except for the panic that it causes.

Probably true, but because the media and everything is tied in with the elites, you will see a lot of extra drama and the sky is falling blathering and posturing during this election season.