Going for a new computer - please, some help will be cool

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stonberg
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by stonberg » Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:16 am

FYI...

On my W7 Pro 64-bit system, once it's finally settled down after booting, just over 3GB of RAM is already used up. That's with no user level applications running. YYMV of course!

[Aside: an astonishing 1,100+ threads running in 80+ processes before I run the first application. Wot?!]

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dawman
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by dawman » Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:14 am

Nestor wrote:Well, I would use an SSD only for "C", so I would get a 240GB, for instance. I don't really know which is the real advantage in use, because people tell and speak so many things out there that you get confused. I dson't have any first hand experience with this SSD, so tell me what do you like it for and why, if you don't mind. Cheers.
I wouldn't bother with an SSD for OS+Apps.
You'll see it's performance falter after a year or so since lots of swapping and writes go to SSD.
In Windows 8.1/10 a snapshot of your RAM is taken and reopened the next time you boot.
There's another write w/o asking.

I suggest the Hybrid like Seagate Momentus as it uses SSD/Flash for 8-16GBs depending on model (enough to hold an entire OS) and then your storage is an HDD, mechanical.
Means that drive should last for years.
I got 6 years and counting on my 500GB Momentus+.
It's much faster than a large HDD, same speed as an SSD, but penalty free operation.

For everything else you know what you'll need.
But no to SSDs for an OS+Apps, unless you go with newer NVMe devices.

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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:22 am

I appreciate so very much this advice, thank you brother, I will do this way :)

I investigated them some, and it is perfect, fast and reliable.
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Mr Arkadin
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Mr Arkadin » Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:42 am

I have two 500 GB SSDs and two 1TB hard drives. I put my OS on hard drive 1 for the reasons Jimmy stated. Disc two is for media (audio and video). Again this is because there will be many read/writes to this drive.

SSD1 is for Kontakt and sample libraries and SSD 2 is for BFD3 libraries. I figured I would get the advantage of fast reads, but would only be writing to the drives whenever I add a library.

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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:52 am

Ok, I understand better how the whole thing works... SSD are good for static things, pieces of information you use a lot, but that do not change, like samples.

Well, right now it will be over the top in price for me, to get an SSD HDD, but in the future I might get one of this too. For the moment, I will use the SATA3 HDD 7200 I already have. I have to cut somewhere...
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by dawman » Wed Aug 12, 2015 6:53 pm

Mr Arkadin wrote: SSD1 is for Kontakt and sample libraries and SSD 2 is for BFD3 libraries. I figured I would get the advantage of fast reads, but would only be writing to the drives whenever I add a library.
Exactamente Cabrone....

With the new NVMe devices this is not a problem.
I was going to build a new Z170 but NVMe works well in 8.1 w/ the Z97.
Spectrasonics Omnisphere 2.1 and Kontakt with all NCW Instruments on the Intel 750 is so fast, I see no need for Windows 10 or the new Z170 boards out next week.

I use Dual Live Mode in Omnisphere 2.1. I use to use 1 instance per song.
The progress bar was only a second or so of waiting.
The Intel 750 is so damn fast with 330,000 IOps there is NO progress bar.
I had to do a double take and play my K4 to confirm. Yes, the Dual Live was loaded that quick.

Wish I had such speed back in the 90's.
I could have been a contender........

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tlaskows
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by tlaskows » Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:29 pm

Trust me, you will want an SSD, even if it's a small Sata 6 one. You never need to defrag them.

I was working with my friend's computer the other day and it took over 20 minutes to completely boot Win 7 with his hard drive almost full...

-Tom

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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:17 pm

dawman wrote:
Exactamente Cabrone....
:D :lol: good spanish... he he
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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:30 pm

I am so unplugged today from new technology. Of course, I am amazed at what the market brings now to us after a few years of disconnection... like this 750 drive :o

Right now, I am mastering a 15 songs album, the outcome of work of a long, long time. I am so immersed in what I am doing that there is no space for more. I don’t do much money with these things, but hey, I am in heaven!

Well, the big discovery was to see what my wife came with after so many years of listening to the tracks and silently being behind me, without me realizing it. She was doing something else, and while passing would tell me something about the drums, or the bass, or guitars, etc. Hard to believe for me, but she is pretty amazing at listening and giving me the right advice for subtle problems in the mix. She would not express herself saying “you need a little more space between 70 and 95kz, add a parametric in the voice, and cut it just in the middle frequency”, nothing like that :D , but with simple and unexpected words, she would find out what is going on in the mix and advice me, and this is amazing :) I have musicians friends that cannot do that yet, and they have been in this for ages, but she, she can… he he… :lol: Well, after about 15 good and precise advices, I realized she has developed a capacity to judge a mix and a master, which is pretty astonishing. So now, I have asked her help and she was laughing at this sure, but agreed to do the mix with me for real. I now have a mixing engineer companion at home... :P :)
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braincell
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by braincell » Thu Aug 13, 2015 4:29 pm

Nestor wrote:I have used Asus for many years, not now anyway, I am in GB right now, but all Asus gave me very, very good results and stability.

That can change or there can be a bad batch. It would be wise to test it for 24 hours. They have software for this. You are lucky to be building such a nice computer.

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tlaskows
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by tlaskows » Thu Aug 13, 2015 4:34 pm

braincell wrote:
Nestor wrote:I have used Asus for many years, not now anyway, I am in GB right now, but all Asus gave me very, very good results and stability.

That can change or there can be a bad batch. It would be wise to test it for 24 hours. They have software for this. You are lucky to be building such a nice computer.
I recommend occt linpack test for 24 hrs

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braincell
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by braincell » Thu Aug 13, 2015 4:34 pm

The consensus is that hyperthreading on or off does not really matter much in a modern computer.

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garyb
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by garyb » Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:15 pm

braincell wrote:The consensus is that hyperthreading on or off does not really matter much in a modern computer.
again, matter much to whom or what?
if you are running a bunch of ASIO channels with a Scope card, hyperthreading should be off for good reason. as i keep saying Scope is realtime, nothing else in the computer is, so Scope is vulnerable to having to wait even one extra cycle where other apps may not be. this is because virtual cores must be calculated by actual, real cores. for offline processes, hyperthreading is a way to get the cpu to process data more efficiently. it may or may not make some difference in performance, but the key thing about it is that it must be offline processing for this to work. do current OSs handle this process better than previous ones? yes, but that doesn't necessarily change anything. hyperthreading is kind of the typical shim-sham that the computer makers like to play. they want you to believe that magical virtual cores calculate data parallel to the real cores of the CPU and therefore do more work. hey! while you're at it, let's climb to the sky by pulling up our pants!

it's possible to organize data threads more efficiently when they're offline. guess what else? many processes in the computer that appear to be in realtime are well in the past, calculated offline.

if you want to keep it on and you have no pops or clicks, great!!!
generally, for an audio computer using Scope, turn it off. you won't lose any kind of significant performance.
Last edited by garyb on Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:34 pm

Cool, ok.

I see difference when rendering in After Effects, there, if you have hyperthreading, it seems to go faster, and it makes sense, because it is an offline process.
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by dawman » Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:26 am

Also worth mentioning hyperthreading is not a good choice for synths that use multicore.
U-he Zebra2 HZ will not use more than 1 core but Zebra2 will. When hyperthreading is not disabled synths waste instructions and cycles determinig what is virtual or not basically doing double duty processing information.
Kontakt is optimized for hyperthreading but actually is optimized to ignore the instructions unless the user wants that option.
If hyperthreading was so great for audio there would be no option. It would be coded into the embed.
Also why you see options for multicore instead of hyperthreading on U-he synths.

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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:09 am

That is very clear, I had the idea that hypertheading was properly used, particularly in Kontakt. Well, this is it. This is exactly what I wanted to know.
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:13 am

tlaskows wrote:
braincell wrote:
Nestor wrote:I have used Asus for many years, not now anyway, I am in GB right now, but all Asus gave me very, very good results and stability.

That can change or there can be a bad batch. It would be wise to test it for 24 hours. They have software for this. You are lucky to be building such a nice computer.
I recommend occt linpack test for 24 hrs
dI didn't have a clue about this... cool, I'll download it and get ready for the test, thank's guys :)
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tlaskows
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by tlaskows » Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:23 am

make sure to check 64bit in OCCT. It really stresses the CPU. You will not be able to use the computer at the same time...

-Tom

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braincell
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by braincell » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:23 am

I render in Premiere Pro also.
Nestor wrote:Cool, ok.

I see difference when rendering in After Effects, there, if you have hyperthreading, it seems to go faster, and it makes sense, because it is an offline process.

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Nestor
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Re: Going for a new computer - please, some help will be coo

Post by Nestor » Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:33 am

braincell wrote:I render in Premiere Pro also.
Nestor wrote:Cool, ok.

I see difference when rendering in After Effects, there, if you have hyperthreading, it seems to go faster, and it makes sense, because it is an offline process.
Premier is the best, but I use Vegas Pro, it is more than enough for me. I find it much simpler than Premiere and I can do the same, and it is way cheaper.
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