Some SDK docs to share

Tips and advice for getting the most from Scope. No questions here please.

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faxinadu
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by faxinadu » Thu Dec 14, 2017 10:55 pm

- the whole idea is loading and unloading of dsps (ok maybe in live is pushing it hehe) :) !!!!!!!!!!!
- making it -1 is very good thought
- another thing to make sure would be that synth is initialized with the power on inside

- making it per-device like you mentioned will work of course, but then you lose the ability of setting groups and/or turning off/on multiple devices with a single button.
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by faxinadu » Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:25 pm

RA wrote:
Thu Dec 14, 2017 10:50 pm
I myself would opt for a small button on the mdl/dev itself, next to the name
btw did you manage to be able to show extra components on the device itself? in sdk it works but when i tried this in the past, when i took the dev to scope the dev reverted to default scope view with just the name.
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by RA » Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:51 am

did you manage to be able to show extra components on the device itself
Dunno faxi. Was a thought on your idea. Have to give it a try
The grouping yes indeed...but with a 'dsp set' that isnt necessay :wink:
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by faxinadu » Fri Dec 15, 2017 1:03 am

- try, i think it does not work. try for example in the go tree of the device itself change the graphic. in sdk it works. save and go to scope load the dev and it loads the default scope device background :/

- what do you mean by dsp set?
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by sunmachine » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:11 am

RA wrote:
Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:35 pm
I did not know or realize there were no docs supplied with the latest SDK releases (5.1 and 7).
The manual for SDK 5.1 is available here: http://scope.zone/index.php?id=1978&lg= ... dditionals
(it's essentially the same as the version 4 manual as far as I can tell)

RA wrote:
Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:35 pm
So let's use this opportunity by setting up these guidelines, conventions or standardization for devices and/or module creation, so, as we agree, we can maintain an overall high quality and a happy user experience.

I propose two categories; "Essential Device requirements" and "Preferable Device Requirements". This way we can distill a checklist, and give a device an "Approved" label or something like that...how about that idea? How can we shape this? Any comments, suggestions, additions?
I'm all for this!
Maybe let's start a new thread to discuss this idea further.

I've added two more items to the above list by the way.

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by RA » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:39 am

Good idea Sunmachine. I will start another thread later...now is dinnertime. Any suggestions where to put it? Scope and xite development sub forum?

Good finding the docs. By default it isnt included in the download files.

I'll check if i can html/bbcode a table here for a good overview of the checklist which we can expand over time. (have to check with Valis for the table BBcoding)
Last edited by RA on Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by sunmachine » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:58 am

RA wrote:
Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:39 am
Good idea Sunmachine. I will start another thread later...now is dinnertime. Any suggestions where to put it? Scope and xite development sub forum?
That's the proper place to go I guess :) Thanks!
I think a more extended Developer Forum with several subforums would also be a good thing.

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by RA » Fri Dec 15, 2017 2:28 pm

I will set it up later, hopefully in a tabled manner.

A few points which came to mine that are important imho:

-Dynamic DSP switching (unload unused features) (preferable)
-Or an option to choose between full load/ dynamic load (preferable)
-Right Click menu's (Essential)
-Phase Coherency with 2 channels(stereo or MS stuff)! (Essential)
-Phase Coherency Multichannel (Prefereable, not always possible)
-Compatible in different scope versions and/or hardware (might seem obsolete, but it isn't) (preferable, not always possible)
-When a device gets updated, try to maintain as much backwards compatibility as possible, especially with presets (Essential)
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by sunmachine » Fri Dec 15, 2017 2:55 pm

Looks like that SDK doc was assembled by sonicstrav rather than shroomz:
viewtopic.php?p=275929#p275929

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by RA » Fri Dec 15, 2017 3:02 pm

Yep credit to sonicstrav...will change that asap. Sorry for this mixup!
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by valis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:09 am

Hey guys, what if we use joomla on the frontend to achieve this, instead of trying to force bbcode to do it? Check the front page and you'll have joomla with a single module active at present that leads here... just sayin :D

Basically the workflow would be public discussion (and a bit in the dev area), actual documentation created and worked on in the CMS, and then continuing discussion of what needs to be done and the current state of said documentation can remain here in the forums where it makes sense.

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by w_ellis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:18 am

Many of these docs are already on the SDK Wiki and it would be great if those that aren't already get uploaded there. Also there are places for tips and tricks + known issues etc.

So far however, in the time since I put it up, there's been almost no contribution to it apart from mine. If people aren't happy with the wiki and would prefer to move the content elsewhere, that's also fine with me, I'll save on hosting costs and maintenance :)

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by w_ellis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:21 am

P.S. One of the reasons for making access to the wiki on request only was because some of the material used to require NDAs to be signed, or at least that people had an SDK license in place. If these requirements are no longer in place (given lots is being uploaded here anyway), I could open up read only access to the public.

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by valis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:43 am

w_ellis, forgive me I am late to the discussion and new to the SDK as well. Where is the wiki?

I was directed to this thread because there were requests to extend the forum's bbcode to encapsulate the needs of documenting this stuff.

Whether that documentation lives on a CMS here or a wiki somewhere else matters less to me than that we have some way to create coherency and accessibility of that information. Ie, users having to trawl through dozens to hundreds of posts to gather the right information is useful when we are DISCOVERING or first sharing those essential nuggets of information, but repeating that same 'seeking' over & over again seems to be woefully inefficent. Having the basics documented elsewhere seems ideal to me as well as I am also in favor of focusing our community's efforts into places that make sense, not creating redundancy and inefficiency for Scope users in general.

I still believe Forums are a great place for discussion and thus play host to these, but they sit in a middle land between social media (the modern variant of forums for discussion) and actual 'hypertext documentation' which is what the web descended from (an index and proper documentation WITH hyperlinks was documented originally by IBM *years* before the 'world wide web' was a thing). So, I'll defer to comments at this point...

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by w_ellis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:57 am

If anyone here doesn't already have access to the SDK Wiki and would like to take a look to give feedback about whether it's worth maintaining, then drop me a PM. I'll get accounts set up as soon as I'm able.

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by RA » Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:41 am

I agree with valis. It wasnt easy to get to the info on the Sdk. The docs that are shared here in this post, were actually already on planetz. I wasnt aware. Google also doesnt show pages that are locked. The wiki has a lot of good info. Great work w_ellis! There are snippets of info scattered on the web, but the one place you go to for info on scope is Planetz. So maybe it is a good idea to tunnel the info there. I signed the same agreement of SC so i am aware that not all could easily be shared but things have changed. The reason i wanted to setup this discussion is to give some guidance to new sdk users who step in with v7. Nothing new, but a sort if standardisation would be new i think (correct me if im wrong) and the mail goal would be to have good devices that have a pleasant user experiences. (And ofcourse rely on)

We surely would NOT want to bypass any of you who did a hell of a job setting things up and collecting....but maybe it is a good idea setting things up so the can be more easily reached from this point...i mean planetz....as a sort of gateway, or move some info here. Scope7 is a new chapter, and sometimes we have to redirect into a new direction...or at least discuss it. But really W_ellis and sharc, you guys have done a lot of work on your wiki, and we owe you a big thanks. So...how do we move on? Do we set something up in the new joomla or gateway it from there...would be sleeker and easier than searching 300000 posts?
Last edited by RA on Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by valis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 5:58 am

On that note, it's up to w_ellis and you guys, who will have to do the bulk of the work.

For my end, I see the joomla frontend as a way to at least post some basic system compatibility tips and simple builds, ebay systems etc that can be useful for people who come by used scope cards. A bit of info for Xite power users too. So having some SDK documentation there will be fine by me, but I already once tried putting wiki software on this box before and it sat idle and largely unused aside from hubird and at0m, and it's disk bound as well. So if you want to stay with wiki abilities, stick with w_ellis.

That being said, joomla has a great publishing model and it's certainly no more closed than the wiki is now if you have to request access.

Also, I think it would be good to get clarity from holger regardless of which direction the wiki goes (staying wiki or going CMS), so there's clarity on that point.

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by RA » Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:16 am

I think i know how holgers vision is with this. He is totally ok with sharing docs and knowledge on this point. I asked him about the sdk documentation and he himself approved. Of course it is something else if any sc devices were cracked or opened and got thrown into the web. That is something different. We dont want that ofcourse. But sharing knowlegde on how to build with the sdk and the modules with that...how would one else come by? But i will ask him to make a statement on this.
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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by valis » Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:17 am

Ok, so make a decision amongst yourselves and if there's anything I need to do to help, I'm here. I still intend to flesh out the front of the site regardless, so have asked for help with that in general as I don't have the time to do it as a solo mission. This could be a good way to start that...

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Re: Some SDK docs to share

Post by sunmachine » Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:55 am

I'd say let's try the Joomla approach and see what we can do with it and how to include the wiki content (if we are allowed to).

First content could be:
- a quick start guide for beginners (where to find things and how to get started)
- links to the SC SDK page and downloads
- the documents from this thread
- (links to) example devices
- developer guidelines (and how to do all that)
- tips/best practises collection

It would be great if at least some of the content would be downloadable as PDF to have it available offline as well.
Is this easily possible with Joomla?

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