planning new scope system for Live usage

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RA
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by RA » Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:30 pm

You might also want to try w7 x32 with vdat if you want to use prerecorded tracks with scope processing....zero latency...once you start using asio or wave or anything windows related > latency....
See scope as a sort of....standalone unit...you need windows because you need to see something going on...but the card itself is a standalone unit actually

Correct me if i'm wrong anyone
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Manomars
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:47 am

RA wrote:Hello Manomars,



I went for the 1150 socket option, and came from a dual opteron dual core...but i won't do an amd system ever again. yeah yeah...it's cheaper, but intel is just very good, less compat problems, and they run cooler....especially live that is important. Go for a good psu...not some cheap one...and make sure your case in well ventilated...especially live...


Cheers, Ray
I hear you Ray thanks,

I think you're right about the 1150 way is the best option.
In fact there are a few 1150 boards still giving u the option of assigning irq. If u force windows (yes u can) to lock PCI on bios and have no devices or drivers cousing lagspikes Scope will run just fine on 64 bit.
As my system is purposed for live usage i've got the pulsar 2 system on hold. Eventually i'll build a 1150 sytem for it.
Got 2builds in 19 inch case now both old 1366 boards running i7 extreme and dual xeon. As i running most signals realtime over adat from ada8200 to x32 digital mixer. Both systems are feed to there one RME raydat getting signals from the direct out of the x32. I just layer the original sounds and with 7 ms roundtrip and realtime monitoting i dont feel any latency. Synths are all hardware and only the loops we use coming from reason and ableton have latency. But that latency is reduced to zero as we play on those beats and it doesnt matter if we push play and the beat starts 0.7 ms later.

When i started out i thought the pulsar would be my main item to achieve near zero latency andf have a solid build for live for cheap. It turned out to be less easy and less cheap as i thought it would be.

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RA
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by RA » Thu Dec 01, 2016 10:58 am

I think you'referring to the standard option to install windows instead of the acpi option? If so that could give other problem if you have the gods working against you hehe. Hope i recall correct...the acpi gives more than 16 irq and standard shuts that off...so with alot of extras on the mobo there could be more sharing causing more troubles...but it has been a while and i could be mixing up some things...for me the main option which was interesting was pci latency for dsp performance. From what i get from your story is that you use it mainly as a soundcard while it can do so much more...especially fx and synth wise. Scope just has a sound...it's alive...omg haha....well if it works for you....should try optimus prime for nice fx. Wink wink hehe. Nice to read you guys also use hw synths...nice man! Phat soundzzz...dont get that put of cpu synths...but can get from sc synths. Faxi has some nice devs and tons of presets...just saying.

Well..if you have spent some doekoe on the hw rig a little spending for scope shouldnt and isnt a problem i taste from you...you didnt regret cause your still using or gonna use it. If it runs in the end it will stay running...dont update windooze if not needed. Never touch a running system. ...ahum...ray....you upgraded your system dude...yeahyeah...i know...sata and more and better usb was also a big deal....on the opteron had a sata card in there....booting took like...forever...no really...forever....well...to much ot....enjoy making music! Share some here :) ....off to the drawingboard for me...ray out
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by garyb » Thu Dec 01, 2016 11:07 am

don't use win7/8/10 in standard PC mode unless you really know what you are doing. it's not even necessary to have a stable machine.
the current motherboards are designed to be controlled by the OS.
again, play with the computer or play with music.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by RA » Thu Dec 01, 2016 11:36 am

Ladies and gentlemen....here he was again....our man.................trrrrrrrrrr.......Gary BEEEEEEEEEEEEE! :wink:

>>>again, play with the computer or play with music.

Just gotta love him right? :lol:
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by garyb » Thu Dec 01, 2016 12:41 pm

:D

:lol: don't get me wrong. i'm more than happy to see people playing with the computer, if that's what they like...

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Tue Dec 06, 2016 12:22 am

RA wrote: From what i get from your story is that you use it mainly as a soundcard while it can do so much more...especially fx and synth wise. Scope just has a sound...it's alive...omg haha....well if it works for you....should try optimus prime for nice fx. Wink wink hehe. Nice to read you guys also use hw synths...nice man! Phat soundzzz...dont get that put of cpu synths...but can get from sc synths. Faxi has some nice devs and tons of presets...just saying.

Well..if you have spent some doekoe on the hw rig a little spending for scope shouldnt and isnt a problem i taste from you...you didnt regret cause your still using or gonna use it. If it runs in the end it will stay running...dont update windooze if not needed. Never touch a running system. ...ahum...ray....you upgraded your system dude...yeahyeah...i know...sata and more and better usb was also a big deal....on the opteron had a sata card in there....booting took like...forever...no really...forever....well...to much ot....enjoy making music! Share some here :) ....off to the drawingboard for me...ray out
The Pulsar will be used for sure, before christmas Doekoe is coming my way and i'll build me a 1150 system for it.
I think it will be used for the synths and aux then. We just starting making music next week i'm busy doing some basic beats and grooves to build out.
I'll drop something for you if we ready for some airplay.
garyb wrote:play with the computer or play with music
The thing is i build a computer dedicated to make music. So i need to play around with the computer before i can make music with it.
Anyway i like both, tweaking the computer and playing music. But i dont bring a computer i,m still playing with to a life performance.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by garyb » Tue Dec 06, 2016 12:56 am

it's cool, i just meant that it's pretty well known what works well and that there's no need to get too crazy with it. the only thing that should never share an irq with the Scope card is USB, and it's easy to disable a controller or two, if needed. new computers have 4 or 5 controllers, at least and 1 controller can support a hub. there's no need to disable ACPI, although that was an important tweak in win98 and early XP. i guess LAN or firewire, or built-in audio could also make a problem with a shared IRQ, but only if they were being used at the same time as the Scope card.

i've used Scope systems live many times. so has Jimmy(Dawman, wherever he is). i certainly don't think it's crazy. be sure that you have good power, though. bad AC could ruin your month...

i agree about never upgrading a running system. unless there's new software that you MUST have, i wouldn't update a music-only computer that runs well.

Manomars
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Tue Dec 06, 2016 1:27 am

garyb wrote:it's cool, i just meant that it's pretty well known what works well and that there's no need to get too crazy with it. the only thing that should never share an irq with the Scope card is USB, and it's easy to disable a controller or two, if needed. new computers have 4 or 5 controllers, at least and 1 controller can support a hub. there's no need to disable ACPI, although that was an important tweak in win98 and early XP. i guess LAN or firewire, or built-in audio could also make a problem with a shared IRQ, but only if they were being used at the same time as the Scope card.

i've used Scope systems live many times. so has Jimmy(Dawman, wherever he is). i certainly don't think it's crazy. be sure that you have good power, though. bad AC could ruin your month...

i agree about never upgrading a running system. unless there's new software that you MUST have, i wouldn't update a music-only computer that runs well.
No worry Gary,

There still motherboards out there with irq assign without disabling ACPI. With that u can assign USB to other IRQ.
I was having troubles becourse i was using sytems i already had and all had some issues to work around.
So my next move would be buying something that others here on the forum have good expirience with.
I only need a few usb ports so turning of would'nt be a problem.
Only thing is i think i need a new breakout cable cours midi in doesnt work anymore.

The thing i do is make a image of the working system, if anything fucks the system up i can reinstall within 5 minutes.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by garyb » Tue Dec 06, 2016 2:02 am

that's right. for live you'll want SSDs for quick boots, too.

the breakout cable will have to be made or fixed by you. it's pretty basic, if you are a good solderer.
dante put the details on his site:
http://www.hitfoundry.com/issue_15/dsub_mst.htm

Manomars
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Tue Dec 06, 2016 2:53 am

Well thanks again Gary,
I can still solder only i need to wear glasses nowadays :)
As i want to build a custom made case anyway a litle more work wont be the problem.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Thu Dec 08, 2016 3:01 am

Update,

Picked up a Gigabyte GA-Z87P-D3 motherboard.
It got 4 pci slots on it. Already had 4 x8 ddr3 Ram lying around. Only need to look for a processor now and i can build.
My plan is to build the system in a 2u case custom made or whats on the market.
Will use pci extender to flip the pulsar horizontaly.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by garyb » Thu Dec 08, 2016 11:06 am

just use a 3 or 4 space case and avoid heat and connection problems from the riser cable/adaptor.
Scope cards make a lot of heat. a bigger case is a better idea.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Sat Dec 17, 2016 4:42 am

Tkz Gary,

That 1150 motherboard was failing, just have no luck at all with the pulsar.
In the mean time i upgraded my z800 tot 2x xeon 5660 and 48 gyg ram for only 100 euro.
Bought a secondhand RME 9652 for it. The z800 realy is a beast and did the reason stresstest with a glance.
Now i have two systems running with RME's. 1 for reason 1 for ableton and vst's. It all works like a charm.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by dawman » Sun Jan 01, 2017 10:02 am

4 space cases are better as the psu and fans from atx towers fit easy and are cheaper more available.
I have towers and 4U.
Hope you get things working.
Scopes mixers and effects are so easy to use live and sound even better with external hardware.
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RA
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by RA » Sun Jan 01, 2017 12:26 pm

Dawman, could be scaled down a bit :lol: :D
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by dante » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:13 pm

RA - you can scale it yourself - CTL and '-' key on the numeric keypad :)

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RA
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by RA » Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:00 pm

Dante...yeah i know...but i got fed up with carying the kb with me and it sucked the juice outta my phone :P :roll:

Long time no see :wink: 8
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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by dante » Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:22 pm

All good here - on the last part of a 2 year audio migration project.... can see you've been busy too !! well done on the new plugs.

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Re: planning new scope system for Live usage

Post by Manomars » Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:49 pm

I've been busy and still am course we getting a new house soon and make the old house ready for sell.
Got my system installed at a band members house.
I think my system rocks and doesnt need upgrades anymore.
In this situation i think the pulsar gonna eat dust again.
So finaly i'm ready to sell it.

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