bottle+crash

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:15 pm

Hi.

Landed back on PlanetZ again.

I'm patching out some inharmonic FX and this is one.

I'm not really experienced, but the device sounds anyway cool, especially hitting shortly around the E4 key, and very soon hitting again, holding 'till the envelope will run out of time.

Any comment, hint or advice will be highly appreciated.

==EDITED==
Attachment deleted: improved patch files in the next posts

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 9:17 am

So what, guys? Why all you speachless?

Ok, it's just kind of a little "side FX", and probably could be better to have it as sample instead as a modular patch, altough it's somehow "musical" and slightly randomized (that can be better or worst, since i was not able to randomize it in a better way ) .

Maybe i'm getting wrong my approach with modular things...

Also i'm not so experienced with FM synthesis using more than two operators; probably the glass sound could be enhanced...
However i've changed the envelope for the noise section, the way a subtle level of noise goes decaying after the attack and the main decay stages.

I'm also going to attach a Mp3 sample.

==ADDED==
I see the download count for the patch in this post is increasing also after I uploaded the new one.
THE DEVICE ATTACHED IN THIS POST LACKS OF A SAMPLE AND HOLD MODULE, SO THE CRASH/SMASH SOUNDS A LITTLE BOGUS.

THE IMPROVED DEVICE IS IN THE NEXT POST.

FOR PEOPLE IN NEED OF A LIGHTER OR SIMPLIER DEVICE: HAVE A LOOK AT THE PATCH IN THE NEXT POST TO SEE HOW SUCH SAMPLE AND HOLD IS PLACED .

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:37 pm

Hi Stardust.

Thanks for your reply.

it's really difficult indeed to squeeze more than 1 sound (the crash) from the patch.
So i've spent some time modifying it with kind of keyboard split (i also added a sample and hold module that make the crash more realistic), and now it truly deserves its name 'bottle+crash', although it has become a rather complex patch.
Maybe too complex, considering its nature of "side FX". However i've added some label which could help coming out of the maze.

I was also trying some different settings for a 'bell string' like sequence, but i'd some trouble with presets; not all the settings are recalled back, i.e. the wet knob in the delay module, the level knob related to the noise osc, and some other thing.

Unluckily i still have some trouble with my daw (i.e. Flexor AD envelopes won't work at all. I reinstalled Flexor yesterday and they worked fine just 'till i shut down). Kind of trouble i was not able to solve by myself .

Tomorrow i'll attempt again with the preset thing, then let u know.

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:11 pm

I'm glad for that misunderstanding. It made myself have look at the patch with the eyes of someone else, dealing with it but having not built it. Then I was not able to do without improvements.
And improvements are always good things.

In the first stage of development the LFO driving the crash tones sequence was set to a slightly lower rate; that way a short key hit delivered the bottle sound more easily; but the crash sequence was too slow...

No way with presets, however. They won't work with Modular in my daw.
(Not sure yet if they don't work at all; i've to check).

It's a pity. I was beginning to think about a different approach...

About the patch: slightly different decay level settings for the single sound env to the carrier and for the common env to the modulator can improve the bottle sound.
I tryied adding a further modulator (for the carrier), but it appears useless to me.

It isn't worth while to upload the patch again just for some setting, IMO.

Maybe it could be good to upload a 24 bit .wav sample of the crash

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 1:46 pm

Hi, it's not really a 'crash' as such. It's more like bottle+'smash', with the bottle being 'smashed'.

it's cool anyway

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 3:46 pm

Hi Shroomz. Thx for replying.

In the neighbourhood of the audio out there's a MIx2 for the noise/sound mix.
Increasing the sound w/s noise level I think the bottle could be less smashed.
That way could be better to increase the level for single sound env2noise for a less bellish single sound.

Or you was thinking about something like a crash cymbal?

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 3:52 pm

Shroomz wrote:Hi, it's not really a 'crash' as such. It's more like bottle+'smash', with the bottle being 'smashed'.

it's cool anyway

P.S.

1) Are you talking about the first or the second version?

2) Is a smash more, or less xplosive than a crash?

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 10:51 am

Hi there,

1. I listened to the sample you had posted just before writing a post.

2. Well, it's just that crash isn't a word normally associated with a bottle in english. Instead the word smash is used. At least using 'smash' there won't be anyone thinking it's a cymbal

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:06 pm

Sorry Shroomz, i'm not that good in English.

I always heard the word 'crash' associated with something abruptly ending his run, so i was thinking 'bottlecrash' might been the right word for the sound of a breaking bottle.

I just saw in the Device forum you've worked around drum sound generators ( i haven't got yet the time to try them) , so IMHO it's easier for you to associate a bottle with a crash cymbal (although, processing cymbals with some old flanger...).

It's too busy now to edit all the posts and attachments to change the word, but i'll remember this issue the next time i'll gonna talk about such things.

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:19 pm

I didn't associate a bottle with a crash cymbal. I knew just from reading the thread title that you most likely meant that the patch was supposed to be a bottle smashing sound. I didn't mean to nit-pick, just thought I'd mention that the word 'crash' is not normally associated with the word 'bottle'. It's common uses would be 'car crash' ' stock market crash' etc. Does that make sense?

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:29 pm

I've to thank you cause this way i go on improving my English.

Never thought you nit-picking. Since in my dictionary the difference between the two words is not well highlighted, and since the 'smash' sounds rather weak and excessively synthetic in my first attempt, I supposed 'smash' could been a better fitting word for that.

Let me joke a bit:

You didn't really thought about a cymbal even for a frame?

Cochise · Post by **Cochise** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:16 pm

==HELP PLEASE==

Could anyone of the people that downloaded this patch (the 2nd one) tell me if there's some problem storing and recalling presets for parameters like the mix2 knob values and the multiseg points rearrangement?

=ADDED=
OK, I can see the matter was widely discussed in previous threads.